Re: Blanket pronouncements

[Guest guest]

Rod,

I agree with you completely. I also want to see the research and clinical data

that forms the basis for any pronouncement made in this forum. Many people

believe that their reactions to a drug or supplement means that all others will

or should have the same reactions. However, bodies and diseases are much too

complicated for that. I also would like to see the context for any claim, such

as other drugs and supplements being taken, along with dosages, timeframes, and

dietary considerations.

--Greg

>

> I find it QUITE FRUSTRATING when many of you make your pronouncements about

> what to do and back it up with no documentation, or of who you are, a Dr. of

> what! Like this probiotic thing. Refrigerate, or not. Yeah, " you must " ,

> or " not necessary " . Seldom a WHY to back up the claim, or a source of the

> claim, other than an old wives tale? I admit to liking as much info as

> possible when a claim is made. Some of you sound like experts, when you may

> not be. Recently someone told me I wouldn't last long if I didn't take

> LDN! On whose authority? It does make me feel that this forum is just a

> place for people to make unsubstantiated claims with NO responsibility.

>

> Thankfully some of you relate your personal experiences, which is very

> helpful, at least! Please, if you make a CLAIM about something, either give

> some background, relate your personal experience, or refer to a source of

> information so we can do some research and decide for ourselves.

>

> Many thanks!

> Rod

>

[Guest guest]

This is a forum of regular people sharing experiences.  You may not like how they write, or that they come off sounding too much this way or that way but personally I find your email offensive.  It is not my job or anyone else's to look up sources for you.  You can google just as well as anyone else here.  If you read something and are unsure of the veracity of it google it.  People speak from their own experiences.   If you find it so problematic you can leave the list.

JaxiOn Sun, Apr 3, 2011 at 1:17 AM, Rodney Gisick <rodgis44@...> wrote:

I find it QUITE FRUSTRATING when many of you make your pronouncements about what to do and back it up with no documentation, or of who you are, a Dr. of what!  Like this probiotic thing.  Refrigerate, or not.  Yeah, " you must " , or " not necessary " .  Seldom a WHY to back up the claim, or a source of the claim, other than an old wives tale?  I admit to liking as much info as possible when a claim is made.  Some of you sound like experts, when you may not be.  Recently someone told me I wouldn't last long if I didn't take LDN!  On whose authority?  It does make me feel that this forum is just a place for people to make unsubstantiated claims with NO responsibility.

Thankfully some of you relate your personal experiences, which is very helpful, at least!  Please, if you make a CLAIM about something, either give some background, relate your personal experience, or refer to a source of information so we can do some research and decide for ourselves.

Many thanks!Rod    

[Guest guest]

Rod-- You seem to have misunderstood the nature of the posts about

probiotics. As I have stated very clearly, some probiotics are

specifically packaged to not require refrigeration. Others require

refrigeration. There has been no disagreement about that fact in the posts

on this subject.

--

At 09:47 AM 4/3/2011, you wrote:

>This is a forum of regular people sharing experiences. You may not like

>how they write, or that they come off sounding too much this way or that

>way but personally I find your email offensive. It is not my job or

>anyone else's to look up sources for you. You can google just as well as

>anyone else here. If you read something and are unsure of the veracity of

>it google it. People speak from their own experiences. If you find it

>so problematic you can leave the list.

>

>Jaxi

>

>On Sun, Apr 3, 2011 at 1:17 AM, Rodney Gisick

><<mailto:rodgis44@...>rodgis44@...> wrote:

>

>

>I find it QUITE FRUSTRATING when many of you make your pronouncements

>about what to do and back it up with no documentation, or of who you are,

>a Dr. of what! Like this probiotic thing. Refrigerate, or not. Yeah,

> " you must " , or " not necessary " . Seldom a WHY to back up the claim, or a

>source of the claim, other than an old wives tale? I admit to liking as

>much info as possible when a claim is made. Some of you sound like

>experts, when you may not be. Recently someone told me I wouldn't last

>long if I didn't take LDN! On whose authority? It does make me feel that

>this forum is just a place for people to make unsubstantiated claims with

>NO responsibility.

>

>Thankfully some of you relate your personal experiences, which is very

>helpful, at least! Please, if you make a CLAIM about something, either

>give some background, relate your personal experience, or refer to a

>source of information so we can do some research and decide for ourselves.

>

>Many thanks!

>Rod

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~

--A.J. Muste

[Guest guest]

On Sun, 03 Apr 2011 10:47:52 -0400, jaxi <jaxi.schulz@...> wrote:> This is a forum of regular people sharing experiences. You may not like > how they write, or that they come off sounding too much this way or that way > but personally I find your email offensive. It is not my job or anyone > else's to look up sources for you. You can google just as well as anyone else> here. If you read something and are unsure of the veracity of it google > it. People speak from their own experiences. If you find it so problematic> you can leave the list.>> JaxiMaybe you shouldn't allow yourself to be so easily offended. A little more civility is in order, I would suggest. Rod made a perfectly legitimate point. There are too many people here who do make categorical statements as if they are medical professionals when they are not. That can be dangerous, and at very least, confusing. The onus to provide correct information SHOULD be on the person writing it. It's certainly my experience with other Internet lists (two are health related, one is literary, one is classical-music related), that when somebody states something that categorically, they are ALWAYS expected to back up what they say either by stating that they are writing from their experience, their own field of inquiry/profession, or by citing how or why they came to the conclusion they're stating. That's normal. Why should anybody believe what you -- or I, or anybody else -- here says, especially when it's about something so important as health and serious illnesses -- unless it can be corroborated?n

[Guest guest]

I agree with n on this. This too has cropped up several times. People do make statements as if they are the professional talking. I was on one forum where someone said her Dr had prescribed LDN for her twice a day based on the research he’s done. She was new to LDN and hadn’t heard of this. The response back was adamantly NO to twice a day dosing despite the recommendation from this persons Dr., and questioning this Drs research. This person was coming across as the voice of authority. If I was new to that forum, I would definitely have thought this was true and be really uncomfortable with that Dr. Through a number of email exchanges on this topic, this person rang Dr Skip who confirmed people are doing this and afterwards felt a lot happier. Odd really as this Dr turned out to be a long time well known prescribing LDN Dr in the USA. Jayne Crocker www.LDNNow.comImportant! Please sign our LDN petition to the European Parliament by clicking heretel: +44 (0) 7877 492 669Dr Steele MBE, talking about LDNLDNNow are a political/pressure group of individuals dedicated to getting Low Dose Naltrexone (LDN) accepted into modern medicine and trialled for the myriad of uses it shows benefit for. . From: low dose naltrexone [mailto:low dose naltrexone ] On Behalf Of n Van TilSent: 03 April 2011 20:43low dose naltrexone Subject: Re: [low dose naltrexone] Blanket pronouncements Maybe you shouldn't allow yourself to be so easily offended. A little more civility is in order, I would suggest. Rod made a perfectly legitimate point. There are too many people here who do make categorical statements as if they are medical professionals when they are not. That can be dangerous, and at very least, confusing. The onus to provide correct information SHOULD be on the person writing it. It's certainly my experience with other Internet lists (two are health related, one is literary, one is classical-music related), that when somebody states something that categorically, they are ALWAYS expected to back up what they say either by stating that they are writing from their experience, their own field of inquiry/profession, or by citing how or why they came to the conclusion they're stating. That's normal. Why should anybody believe what you -- or I, or anybody else -- here says, especially when it's about something so important as health and serious illnesses -- unless it can be corroborated? n

[Guest guest]

How could anyone “back up†their own personal experiences? Most of us are just regular people....sick....and struggling to find something, anything that will help us. We are not “professionals’ and we do not profess to be. I love to hear others experiences, but I still do my research, as we all should. That’s what this list is all about. Sharing. If we have to “corroborate'†everything we share here....what’s the point?

From: n Van Til

Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2011 3:42 PM

low dose naltrexone

Subject: Re: [low dose naltrexone] Blanket pronouncements

On Sun, 03 Apr 2011 10:47:52 -0400, jaxi <jaxi.schulz@...> wrote:Maybe you shouldn't allow yourself to be so easily offended. A little more civility is in order, I would suggest. Rod made a perfectly legitimate point. There are too many people here who do make categorical statements as if they are medical professionals when they are not. That can be dangerous, and at very least, confusing. The onus to provide correct information SHOULD be on the person writing it.

It's certainly my experience with other Internet lists (two are health related, one is literary, one is classical-music related), that when somebody states something that categorically, they are ALWAYS expected to back up what they say either by stating that they are writing from their experience, their own field of inquiry/profession, or by citing how or why they came to the conclusion they're stating. That's normal. Why should anybody believe what you -- or I, or anybody else -- here says, especially when it's about something so important as health and serious illnesses -- unless it can be corroborated?

n

[Guest guest]

I agree. I share what I know, sometimes I give a link but for example, I'm

not going to take the time to find research about whether probiotics need

refrigeration or not. That's a cut and dried fact. If people don't like

some of the information coming across this list, I suggest you simply move

on to the next post. No one is forcing you to consider the information or

even to read it.

I flat do not have the TIME to back up every statement I make. I have

integrity, I work very hard to be factual, and when I can, I'll give a

link. My participation here is already far less than it once was as it is.

best wishes to all,

--

>How could anyone “back up†their own personal experiences? Most of us

>are just regular people....sick....and struggling to find something,

>anything that will help us. We are not “professionals’ and we do not

>profess to be. I love to hear others experiences, but I still do my

>research, as we all should. That’s what this list is all about. Sharing.

>If we have to “corroborate'†everything we share here....what’s the

>point?

>

>From: <mailto:mvantil@...>n Van Til

>Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2011 3:42 PM

>To:

><mailto:low dose naltrexone >low dose naltrexone

>Subject: Re: [low dose naltrexone] Blanket pronouncements

>

>On Sun, 03 Apr 2011 10:47:52 -0400, jaxi <jaxi.schulz@...> wrote:

>

>

>Maybe you shouldn't allow yourself to be so easily offended. A little more

>civility is in order, I would suggest. Rod made a perfectly legitimate

>point. There are too many people here who do make categorical statements

>as if they are medical professionals when they are not. That can be

>dangerous, and at very least, confusing. The onus to provide correct

>information SHOULD be on the person writing it.

>

>It's certainly my experience with other Internet lists (two are health

>related, one is literary, one is classical-music related), that when

>somebody states something that categorically, they are ALWAYS expected to

>back up what they say either by stating that they are writing from their

>experience, their own field of inquiry/profession, or by citing how or why

>they came to the conclusion they're stating. That's normal. Why should

>anybody believe what you -- or I, or anybody else -- here says, especially

>when it's about something so important as health and serious illnesses --

>unless it can be corroborated?

>

>n

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~

--A.J. Muste

[Guest guest]

heres mei'm a psychiatric nurse been a nurse since 1998for ten years i worked at a compounding pharmacyall those videos -i took them http://web.me.com/clenz/Site/Welcome.htmlalso an award winning filmmaker - long storymy info about the probiotics comes directly by dealing in the vitamin world and doing research.my ldn knowledge comes from going to most of the conferences and video taping and editingany questions please feel to askcyndi al counseling since 1998On Apr 3, 2011, at 10:27 AM, G Ash wrote:

Rod,

I agree with you completely. I also want to see the research and clinical data that forms the basis for any pronouncement made in this forum. Many people believe that their reactions to a drug or supplement means that all others will or should have the same reactions. However, bodies and diseases are much too complicated for that. I also would like to see the context for any claim, such as other drugs and supplements being taken, along with dosages, timeframes, and dietary considerations.

--Greg

>

> I find it QUITE FRUSTRATING when many of you make your pronouncements about

> what to do and back it up with no documentation, or of who you are, a Dr. of

> what! Like this probiotic thing. Refrigerate, or not. Yeah, "you must",

> or "not necessary". Seldom a WHY to back up the claim, or a source of the

> claim, other than an old wives tale? I admit to liking as much info as

> possible when a claim is made. Some of you sound like experts, when you may

> not be. Recently someone told me I wouldn't last long if I didn't take

> LDN! On whose authority? It does make me feel that this forum is just a

> place for people to make unsubstantiated claims with NO responsibility.

>

> Thankfully some of you relate your personal experiences, which is very

> helpful, at least! Please, if you make a CLAIM about something, either give

> some background, relate your personal experience, or refer to a source of

> information so we can do some research and decide for ourselves.

>

> Many thanks!

> Rod

>

[Guest guest]

sorry typo been a nurse since 1978 i work in medicare home health On Apr 3, 2011, at 10:08 PM, Cyndi Lenz wrote:

heres mei'm a psychiatric nurse been a nurse since 1998for ten years i worked at a compounding pharmacyall those videos -i took them http://web.me.com/clenz/Site/Welcome.htmlalso an award winning filmmaker - long storymy info about the probiotics comes directly by dealing in the vitamin world and doing research.my ldn knowledge comes from going to most of the conferences and video taping and editingany questions please feel to askcyndi al counseling since 1998On Apr 3, 2011, at 10:27 AM, G Ash wrote:

Rod,

I agree with you completely. I also want to see the research and clinical data that forms the basis for any pronouncement made in this forum. Many people believe that their reactions to a drug or supplement means that all others will or should have the same reactions. However, bodies and diseases are much too complicated for that. I also would like to see the context for any claim, such as other drugs and supplements being taken, along with dosages, timeframes, and dietary considerations.

--Greg

>

> I find it QUITE FRUSTRATING when many of you make your pronouncements about

> what to do and back it up with no documentation, or of who you are, a Dr. of

> what! Like this probiotic thing. Refrigerate, or not. Yeah, "you must",

> or "not necessary". Seldom a WHY to back up the claim, or a source of the

> claim, other than an old wives tale? I admit to liking as much info as

> possible when a claim is made. Some of you sound like experts, when you may

> not be. Recently someone told me I wouldn't last long if I didn't take

> LDN! On whose authority? It does make me feel that this forum is just a

> place for people to make unsubstantiated claims with NO responsibility.

>

> Thankfully some of you relate your personal experiences, which is very

> helpful, at least! Please, if you make a CLAIM about something, either give

> some background, relate your personal experience, or refer to a source of

> information so we can do some research and decide for ourselves.

>

> Many thanks!

> Rod

>

[Guest guest]

Given the doctors we sometimes come across, why would I definitely value their opinion over a person who was " just " a user of the medication?I have just been reading here, not posting much but in general on other groups, I give info and maybe where I found it. I don't always want to take the time to do YOUR homework for you by posting my source.

I don't care WHO is typing on this list, you should always do your own research. You cannot trust that the person who signs their email as MD truly is, or maybe they never went into practice, or graduated at the bottom of their class... or they could be a 12 year old kid having fun at your expense. Taking anyone's word for something on the internet is a dangerous thing. ALWAYS do your OWN research.

It took me 9 months to consider LDN before using it. A year to consider high dose vitamin A protocol before using it. " Hundreds " of people recommending. Lots of reading! I've been on a valtrex list for a year, and we STILL haven't used it.

On Sun, Apr 3, 2011 at 7:24 PM, jaynelcrocker <jaynelcrocker@...> wrote:

I agree with n on this.  This too has cropped up several times.  People do make statements as if they are the professional talking.  I was on one forum where someone said her Dr had prescribed LDN for her twice a day based on the research he’s done.  She was new to LDN and hadn’t heard of this. The response back was adamantly NO to twice a day dosing despite the recommendation from this persons Dr., and questioning this Drs research.  This person was coming across as the voice of authority.  If I was new to that forum, I would definitely have thought this was true and be really uncomfortable with that Dr.  Through a number of email exchanges on this topic, this person rang Dr Skip who confirmed people are doing this and afterwards felt a lot happier. 

 Odd really as this Dr turned out to be a long time well known prescribing LDN Dr in the USA.

 Jayne Crocker

 www.LDNNow.com

Important!  Please sign our LDN petition to the European Parliament by clicking here

tel: +44 (0) 7877 492 669Dr Steele MBE, talking about LDN

LDNNow are a political/pressure group of individuals dedicated to getting Low Dose Naltrexone (LDN) accepted into modern medicine and trialled for the myriad of uses it shows benefit for.

.. 

From: low dose naltrexone [mailto:low dose naltrexone ] On Behalf Of n Van Til

Sent: 03 April 2011 20:43low dose naltrexone Subject: Re: [low dose naltrexone] Blanket pronouncements

 Maybe you shouldn't allow yourself to be so easily offended. A little more civility is in order, I would suggest. Rod made a perfectly legitimate point. There are too many people here who do make categorical statements as if they are medical professionals when they are not. That can be dangerous, and at very least, confusing. The onus to provide correct information SHOULD be on the person writing it. 

It's certainly my experience with other Internet lists (two are health related, one is literary, one is classical-music related), that when somebody states something that categorically, they are ALWAYS expected to back up what they say either by stating that they are writing from their experience, their own field of inquiry/profession, or by citing how or why they came to the conclusion they're stating. That's normal. Why should anybody believe what you -- or I, or anybody else -- here says, especially when it's about something so important as health and serious illnesses -- unless it can be corroborated?

 n 

  

-- Toni------Mind like a steel trap...Rusty and illegal in 37 states.

[Guest guest]

Funny, I feel like I learn a little more each time I read something posted on this listserve. While we might all have different experiences, diseases, reactions and side-effects I find it helpful to hear about what works and doesn’t and what forum members have learned along the way of their LDN journey. Its why I put up with the bombardment of messages; to find a piece to the puzzle of alternative medicine and uncommon ideas shared to help me make decisions about my own survival.

All of you that share your experience enrich those of us that are looking for answers that may or may not be commonly known.

I appreciate links and often check them out but I’d be a fool if I didn’t follow up myself with further research.

My mother always told me that you can learn something from every person you ever meet.

Lets keep learning and getting closer to good health.

Thank you to all the experts and others willing to share their life stories.

From: G Ash

Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2011 10:27 AM

low dose naltrexone

Subject: [low dose naltrexone] Re: Blanket pronouncements

Rod,I agree with you completely. I also want to see the research and clinical data that forms the basis for any pronouncement made in this forum. Many people believe that their reactions to a drug or supplement means that all others will or should have the same reactions. However, bodies and diseases are much too complicated for that. I also would like to see the context for any claim, such as other drugs and supplements being taken, along with dosages, timeframes, and dietary considerations. --Greg>> I find it QUITE FRUSTRATING when many of you make your pronouncements about> what to do and back it up with no documentation, or of who you are, a Dr. of> what! Like this probiotic thing. Refrigerate, or not. Yeah, "you must",> or "not necessary". Seldom a WHY to back up the claim, or a source of the> claim, other than an old wives tale? I admit to liking as much info as> possible when a claim is made. Some of you sound like experts, when you may> not be. Recently someone told me I wouldn't last long if I didn't take> LDN! On whose authority? It does make me feel that this forum is just a> place for people to make unsubstantiated claims with NO responsibility.> > Thankfully some of you relate your personal experiences, which is very> helpful, at least! Please, if you make a CLAIM about something, either give> some background, relate your personal experience, or refer to a source of> information so we can do some research and decide for ourselves.> > Many thanks!> Rod>

[Guest guest]

I think we have confusion on what is meant by " pronouncement, " which is actually

an " authoritative declaration. " Relating personal experience is great and

beneficial. But, for example, if someone says that LDN users must take magnesium

supplements for it to work correctly, then I would want to know the basis for

that pronouncement (the who, what, when, where, why, and how).

I hope that all users continue to share their personal experiences, as I have

found those to be very beneficial. But if someone tells me that I must do

something, then I want to know why, which may just be a link to the details from

another site.

--Greg

>

>

> Maybe you shouldn't allow yourself to be so easily offended. A little more

civility is in order, I would suggest. Rod made a perfectly legitimate point.

There are too many people here who do make categorical statements as if they are

medical professionals when they are not. That can be dangerous, and at very

least, confusing. The onus to provide correct information SHOULD be on the

person writing it.

>

> It's certainly my experience with other Internet lists (two are health

related, one is literary, one is classical-music related), that when somebody

states something that categorically, they are ALWAYS expected to back up what

they say either by stating that they are writing from their experience, their

own field of inquiry/profession, or by citing how or why they came to the

conclusion they're stating. That's normal. Why should anybody believe what you

-- or I, or anybody else -- here says, especially when it's about something so

important as health and serious illnesses -- unless it can be corroborated?

>

> n

>

[Guest guest]

Jaxi is absolutely correct, I too find the email from Rod offensive. LDN works for me I do not feel that I have to back up that experience with documentation, I take what other say just like that. If I want additional information I know where to look, don't you???Stirling

I find it QUITE FRUSTRATING when many of you make your pronouncements about what to do and back it up with no documentation, or of who you are, a Dr. of what! Like this probiotic thing. Refrigerate, or not. Yeah, "you must", or "not necessary". Seldom a WHY to back up the claim, or a source of the claim, other than an old wives tale? I admit to liking as much info as possible when a claim is made. Some of you sound like experts, when you may not be. Recently someone told me I wouldn't last long if I didn't take LDN! On whose authority? It does make me feel that this forum is just a place for people to make unsubstantiated claims with NO responsibility.

Thankfully some of you relate your personal experiences, which is very helpful, at least! Please, if you make a CLAIM about something, either give some background, relate your personal experience, or refer to a source of information so we can do some research and decide for ourselves.

Many thanks!Rod

[Guest guest]

you are the some of your own choices and people [incl rod] should be allowed free speech and he is correct as a little unqualified knolwedge can do a lot of harm, any experience with ldn is personal to the writer

there are no 2 people the same with regard performance of ldn

regards/peter/london/ppms

Jaxi is absolutely correct, I too find the email from Rod offensive. LDN works for me I do not feel that I have to back up that experience with documentation, I take what other say just like that. If I want additional information I know where to look, don't you???Stirling

This is a forum of regular people sharing experiences. You may not like how they write, or that they come off sounding too much this way or that way but personally I find your email offensive. It is not my job or anyone else's to look up sources for you. You can google just as well as anyone else here. If you read something and are unsure of the veracity of it google it. People speak from their own experiences. If you find it so problematic you can leave the list.

Jaxi

On Sun, Apr 3, 2011 at 1:17 AM, Rodney Gisick <rodgis44@...> wrote:

I find it QUITE FRUSTRATING when many of you make your pronouncements about what to do and back it up with no documentation, or of who you are, a Dr. of what! Like this probiotic thing. Refrigerate, or not. Yeah, "you must", or "not necessary". Seldom a WHY to back up the claim, or a source of the claim, other than an old wives tale? I admit to liking as much info as possible when a claim is made. Some of you sound like experts, when you may not be. Recently someone told me I wouldn't last long if I didn't take LDN! On whose authority? It does make me feel that this forum is just a place for people to make unsubstantiated claims with NO responsibility.Thankfully some of you relate your personal experiences, which is very helpful, at least! Please, if you make a CLAIM about something, either give some

background, relate your personal experience, or refer to a source of information so we can do some research and decide for ourselves.Many thanks!Rod

[Guest guest]

I think it’s fair to say that many people on this list

are here because the medical profession has failed them and it’s not

unusual for clinical trials to be less than honest. Personally I would

far prefer to hear of other people’s personal experiences and

recommendations and, if they sound useful, do the research myself.

We can’t have it both ways - diss the

doctors and then call for advice that’s only recommended by them.

A lot of the dietary and supplement advice given freely by this group is not,

in my experience, ever part of traditional clinical practice.... certainly not

in the UK

anyway.

I don’t post very often but do read all the

posts and find so many of them inspiring and full of valuable insights and

treatments for illnesses that I’ve never heard of before.

Ann

[Guest guest]

Thank you, Ann.

Indeed, I found the iodine protocol because someone on this list mentioned

it. I am so thankful for that. But I did my own research once I knew

about it.

--

At 03:16 PM 4/4/2011, you wrote:

>I think it's fair to say that many people on this list are here because

>the medical profession has failed them and it's not unusual for clinical

>trials to be less than honest. Personally I would far prefer to hear of

>other people's personal experiences and recommendations and, if they sound

>useful, do the research myself.

>We can't have it both ways - diss the doctors and then call for advice

>that's only recommended by them. A lot of the dietary and supplement

>advice given freely by this group is not, in my experience, ever part of

>traditional clinical practice.... certainly not in the UK anyway.

> I don't post very often but do read all the posts and find so many of

> them inspiring and full of valuable insights and treatments for illnesses

> that I've never heard of before.

>

>Ann

>

>

>

~~~ There is no way to peace; peace is the way ~~~~

--A.J. Muste

[Guest guest]

Oh I see. Yes, I can see where " you must blah blah blah " would be seen in a different light than " I read that blah blah blah " ;-)On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 9:20 AM, G Ash <gash@...> wrote:

I think we have confusion on what is meant by " pronouncement, " which is actually an " authoritative declaration. " Relating personal experience is great and beneficial. But, for example, if someone says that LDN users must take magnesium supplements for it to work correctly, then I would want to know the basis for that pronouncement (the who, what, when, where, why, and how).

I hope that all users continue to share their personal experiences, as I have found those to be very beneficial. But if someone tells me that I must do something, then I want to know why, which may just be a link to the details from another site.

--Greg

>

>

> Maybe you shouldn't allow yourself to be so easily offended. A little more civility is in order, I would suggest. Rod made a perfectly legitimate point. There are too many people here who do make categorical statements as if they are medical professionals when they are not. That can be dangerous, and at very least, confusing. The onus to provide correct information SHOULD be on the person writing it.

>

> It's certainly my experience with other Internet lists (two are health related, one is literary, one is classical-music related), that when somebody states something that categorically, they are ALWAYS expected to back up what they say either by stating that they are writing from their experience, their own field of inquiry/profession, or by citing how or why they came to the conclusion they're stating. That's normal. Why should anybody believe what you -- or I, or anybody else -- here says, especially when it's about something so important as health and serious illnesses -- unless it can be corroborated?

>

> n

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Well, regardless, it's a lot harder to herd several thousand people on a

mailing list to behave exactly how one wants them to, than simply to adjust

one's expectations accordingly. I suggest that if someone wants more

information, they ask for it, just like people have been doing as long as

I've been on the list. And do one's own research.

--

>Oh I see. Yes, I can see where " you must blah blah blah " would be seen in

>a different light than " I read that blah blah blah "

>;-)

>

>On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 9:20 AM, G Ash

><<mailto:gash@...>gash@...> wrote:

>I think we have confusion on what is meant by " pronouncement, " which is

>actually an " authoritative declaration. " Relating personal experience is

>great and beneficial. But, for example, if someone says that LDN users

>must take magnesium supplements for it to work correctly, then I would

>want to know the basis for that pronouncement (the who, what, when, where,

>why, and how).

>

>I hope that all users continue to share their personal experiences, as I

>have found those to be very beneficial. But if someone tells me that I

>must do something, then I want to know why, which may just be a link to

>the details from another site.

>

>--Greg

>

>

>

> >

> >

> > Maybe you shouldn't allow yourself to be so easily offended. A little

> more civility is in order, I would suggest. Rod made a perfectly

> legitimate point. There are too many people here who do make categorical

> statements as if they are medical professionals when they are not. That

> can be dangerous, and at very least, confusing. The onus to provide

> correct information SHOULD be on the person writing it.

> >

> > It's certainly my experience with other Internet lists (two are health

> related, one is literary, one is classical-music related), that when

> somebody states something that categorically, they are ALWAYS expected to

> back up what they say either by stating that they are writing from their

> experience, their own field of inquiry/profession, or by citing how or

> why they came to the conclusion they're stating. That's normal. Why

> should anybody believe what you -- or I, or anybody else -- here says,

> especially when it's about something so important as health and serious

> illnesses -- unless it can be corroborated?

> >

> > n

> >

>

>

>

>

>------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Greg

I think I understand what you mean, the chosen words often sound quite

authoritarian. I myself am from a different language back ground, and I believe

that some of the misconceptions about the " tone " (pronouncements, or whatever)

comes from English being a second language. I'm sure we with other mother

tongues are grateful for all the information we are getting thanks to being able

to read and write English, but occasionally I also think that some statement

sounds harsh ( " must " instead of " should " or " ought to " , for example) but when I

realise who the writer is and his or her mother tongue is far from English I try

to understand the difficulties. (having made some quite horrendous mistakes

myself before now, oops)

Silvia (PPMS, who found LDN thanks to searching and reading in English, as there

was hardly any information in German just over 2 years ago)

>

> I think we have confusion on what is meant by " pronouncement, " which is

actually an " authoritative declaration. " Relating personal experience is great

and beneficial. But, for example, if someone says that LDN users must take

magnesium supplements for it to work correctly, then I would want to know the

basis for that pronouncement (the who, what, when, where, why, and how).

>

> I hope that all users continue to share their personal experiences, as I have

found those to be very beneficial. But if someone tells me that I must do

something, then I want to know why, which may just be a link to the details from

another site.

>

> --Greg

>