Probiotics

[Guest guest]

Dear Vas,

Most candida sufferers do not do well on yogurt or kefir, even though

they are terrific for probiotics. Most commercially prepared products

are inadequate however, so homemade is recommended in any case, because

you can ferment them long enough to remove most of lactose and you can

also use full-fat whole milk or half & half. Most commercially-made

products are low-fat; the higher the fat content the lower the lactose.

You'd probably do better on " cabbage rejuvelac " (recipe in my main

article, or with non-dairy based lactobacillus acidophilus as

recommended in my article.

Bee

[Guest guest]

Hi Vas

I couldn't find any commercial yogurts in my area that didn't have lots of

additives, and since I'd developed lactose intolerance I wasn't tolerating

the few I did try that had the fewest of additives. So I ended up buying a

yogurt maker and making my own yogurt. I ferment it for 24 hours to remove

most of the lactose. I've been doing that for a year, now. It's made a big

difference, believe me.

It's easy to make yogurt, especially with a yogurt maker. Fermenting it for

24 hours is the important thing (most commercial yogurts are fermented only

for 4 hours). And I use whole milk or half & half which has the least amount

of lactose to begin with.

I also buy an acidophilus-only supplement from an online source that has no

additives; just the one strain of probiotics. I use that on days I don't

have any yogurt; or I'm on antibiotics and need the extra probiotics.

Kim M.

[Guest guest]

--- wrote:

From: Srinivas Archinapalli <archinapalli@...>

Subject: probiotics

Group,

I am looking for some good probiotics/live cultured

yogurt available in the market. Did any one had good

experiences with these products. I think i has lost

all my good bacteria in my which is now causing all

problems

vas

_________________

Hi Vas,

I have used a pro-biotic called " Nature's Biotics " that is soil based.

It eats bad bacteria, and I have used it to cure a sore throat -- empty

a capsule into water and gargle and swallow. They don't need

refrigeration, which is helpful when traveling.

http://www.upwardquest.com/

I saw Dr. Mercola had something similar, and a little less expensive,

though I haven't tried that brand myself:

http://www.mercola.com/forms/primal_defense.htm

I see that Bee has an article in the files:

Prebiotics FOS & Inulin Not Recommended.htm

- T

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[Guest guest]

> BUT when an animal is experiencing stress and/or the

> nutrient supply is cut off, the indigenous microbes

> can be decimated. This opens the door to

> opportunistic pathogens, low lives that have been

> lurking in dark corners for just such an occasion.

>

> This is where probiotic organisms come into play.

> I have compounded some tables that compare popular

> everyday and concentrated probiotics, just write me if

> you would like a copy. I have collected this

> information off the websites for these products. They

> list species and cfu, where available.

Hi Lark,

If one ends up having to take antibiotics (prescription is one tab

every day for 8 weeks) is there any point in taking probiiotics during

that period? Would not the good guys be wiped out by the antis, and

the process be an exercise in futility? Any insight would be

appreciated.

Also, I bought some proboitic capsules (at great expense) to find they

contained Bacillus Lichenformis, which some believe is carcinogenic.

Any ideas?

Thanks,

@ Peaberry

[Guest guest]

Dear Lark and others here: What is your opinion of the VSL3 product?

<http://www.vsl3.com/vsl3/index.asp> http://www.vsl3.com/vsl3/index.asp

Thank you. ~Robin

[Guest guest]

Lark wrote:

>IF your pet gets sick, often the gastrointestinal

tract stops working, enzymes aren't secreted,

absorption often doesn't take place because all energy

is being shunted to the immune system. In this case,

it would not be a good idea to force-feed fermented

food, since it could actually make matters worse.

Thanks for the great explanation of why probiotics don't always work.

BTW I never have to " force-feed " my labs, as they always eat everything {LOL}

Please send me the comparison charts that you have. If they also compare

yoghurt and kefir, perhaps it would be possible to post them to this list for

everyone to see?

and the K9's

[Guest guest]

Lark,

I'd appreciate receiving them. Enjoying your contributions!

-Sharon, NH

Deut 11:14 He will put grass in the fields for your cattle, and you will

have plenty to eat.

I have compounded some tables that compare popular

everyday and concentrated probiotics, just write me if

you would like a copy. I have collected this

information off the websites for these products. They

list species and cfu, where available.

Lark Burnham, Ph.D.

lark@...

_____

[Guest guest]

You're right. I would not take probiotics while taking antibiotics but as

soon as you're finished with the antibiotics, go for it! :-) ~Robin

[Guest guest]

i too would like to look at your comparason charts

thanks,

susan

Pugh wrote:

>

>Please send me the comparison charts that you have. If they also compare

yoghurt and kefir, perhaps it would be possible to post them to this list for

everyone to see?

>

> and the K9's

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> B. lichenformis, I scanned the literature I collected

> on probiotics, and it was mentioned a number of times,

> but only in a positive light. I hadn't heard anything

> about cancer. I wouldn't list as one of the top five

> probiotic organisms. What concentration is listed on

> this product?

>

> Lark

Hi, Lark

There is no concentration listed on the pack or the web site. An

outline of the claims against B. licheniformis are contianed here:

<http://curezone.com/forums/m.asp?f=292 & i=5775>.

Whether this and similar articles provide a scientificlly based cause

for concern may be queried, but in my paranoia I am holding off taking

the probiotics just in case. It seems to be unlikely that there will

be any clarification of this in the foreseeable future. Might just

stick to kefir, raw milk & kimchi etc. And fibre, but fibre wouldn't

be much good without the critters to eat it, which I am destroying

daily.

@ peabberry

[Guest guest]

At 11:51 AM 6/28/2005, you wrote:

> " If one ends up having to take antibiotics

>(prescription is one tab

>every day for 8 weeks) is there any point in taking

>probiiotics during

>that period? Would not the good guys be wiped out by

>the antis, and

>the process be an exercise in futility? Any insight

>would be

>appreciated.

One of my kids had to be on antibiotics for *months*

caused horrid diarrhea and diaper rash. That's one

of the things that got me into kefir. I don't like that the

antibiotics are necessary (I keep looking for other ways

of healing things! ) but with the kefir, there are zero

noticable side effects from them.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

Bee,

I've been reading this thread with interest, as I haven't been taking

probiotics except rejuvelac and occasional plain yogurt... I'm curious whether

you

think someone who's doing pretty well with the diet alone needs to take addl

probiotics? I've gotten the impression that you thought 'food sources' was

adequate, but maybe not? Interested in your opinion... Also whether you think

Kombucha tea would REPLACE rejuvelac or complement it? I'm interested in trying

it, just as something new. Of course I still want to try kefir one of these

days too!

TIA,

Janine

In a message dated 10/10/2005 11:12:29 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,

writes:

From: " Bee Wilder " <beeisbuzzing2003@...>

Subject: Re: Bee probiotics

Rita wrote:

> Hi Bee,

> Have you ever or do you presently take probiotics and

> can you please give me the name what are/were you

> taking?

==>I take Trophic Brand Non-Dairy Acidophilus Plus, but when I had

candida I took Cal-dophilus or Primadophilus (can't remember what

brands) and cabbage rejuvelac.

Bee

[Guest guest]

Janine wrote:

> Bee,> I've been reading this thread with interest, as I haven't

been taking > probiotics except rejuvelac and occasional plain

yogurt... I'm curious whether you > think someone who's doing pretty

well with the diet alone needs to take addl probiotics?

==>Additional probiotics is important for implanting good bacteria in

the gut, but I think food probiotics like cabbage rejuvelac are best.

Unfortunately, most candida sufferers do not do well on yogurt or

kefir.

> I've gotten the impression that you thought 'food sources' was

> adequate, but maybe not? Interested in your opinion... Also whether

you think Kombucha tea would REPLACE rejuvelac or complement it?

==>From what I understand Kombucha tea aids digestion, but I don't

believe it contains good bacteria such as lactobacillus, which makes

up 95% of the bacteria in the small intestines. In that case, no, it

wouldn't replace cabbage rejuvelac.

Bee

[Guest guest]

wrote:

> I am out of my probiotics, fiber supplements and antifungal. (not

> compeltely out, but need to reorder). currently I am using all of

the Renew Life suplements. They have a 50 Billion unit probiotic that

is entereic coated to get past the stomach,

==>It is false that probiotics are harmed or killed by stomach acid.

Your stomach also has mucus membranes and candida overgrowth which

needs probiotics as well. I took powdered probiotics (in water) in the

mid 1980s when I had candida. The best probiotic IMO is cabbage

rejuvelac. For those who don't have the time to make it, they can take

regular lactobacillus capsules or powders available in the health store

as recommended in my article. Many probiotics are highly marketed and

expensive but that does not make them better, i.e. Primal Defense.

>the fiber has flax not psyllium, and the antifungal is candigone which

has all of the usual suspects- P'D'Arco, etc. Any suggestions as to

better products to use? What about Primal Defense? I have been taking

Yeast Cleanse also with coconut oil and garlic. I would like to find

the best out there before I invest in another month's worth of products

if any of you have any input.

==>About fibres check out the article about fibre in the Digestion

Folder in our files. You can take too many products, which will not

make the body heal any faster. The body takes its own time. The idea

to give your body what it needs, but not any more, to nudge it towards

healing. Taking too much will depress the immune system, overwhelming

the body's healing mechanisms. Having coconut oil, garlic and P'au

D'arco are plenty of antifungals, and getting one simple lactobacillus

product and taking 10,000 billions active units per day in divided

doses is adequate. Don't waste your money. The diet is going to do you

the most good.

Bee

[Guest guest]

I have Kyo-Dophilus...acidophilus, bifidum, longum. One capsules = 1.5

billion cells. Are " cells " the same as " units " ? Should I be taking 10,000

" cells " per day?

From: " Bee Wilder "

>>getting one simple lactobacillus product and taking 10,000 billions active

>>units per day in divided

doses is adequate.<<

[Guest guest]

I bought some Primal Defense (P.D.) to have on hand for later after the

Kyo-Dophilus is gone, even tho it's way more expensive. B/c the Kyo-Dophilus

(K.D.) has only 3 strains of probiotics in it & the P.D. has about 14

strains. Shouldn't I be getting as many strains as possible into my body

according to the required doses?

Is it okay to take P.D.or any other probiotic with meals despite what the

label states... " on an empty stomach " ? So I guess that would be l/2 before

meals or 1 hour after?

Contrarily, the K.D. label states it can be sprinkled on food. So can be

taken in capsule form with food too I suppose.

Why do you suppose the P.D.needs to be taken on an empty stomach & the K.D.

doesn't since they're both for the same purpose?

Caroline

From: " Bee Wilder " >

Many probiotics are highly marketed and

expensive but that does not make them better, i.e. Primal Defense.

[Guest guest]

If you don't mind explaining.. how do you make cabbage

rejuvelac?

THANKS

---------------------------------

FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.

[Guest guest]

Caroline wrote:

>

> I bought some Primal Defense (P.D.) to have on hand for later after

the Kyo-Dophilus is gone, even tho it's way more expensive. B/c the

Kyo-Dophilus > (K.D.) has only 3 strains of probiotics in it & the

P.D. has about 14 > strains. Shouldn't I be getting as many strains

as possible into my body > according to the required doses?

==>You do not have to get all of the strains in order for it to be

effective implanting in the bowels. The strains contained in cabbage

rejuvelac and lactobacllilus capsules and powders are fine.

>

> Is it okay to take P.D.or any other probiotic with meals despite

what the > label states... " on an empty stomach " ? So I guess that

would be l/2 before > meals or 1 hour after?

==>That would be okay.

>

> Contrarily, the K.D. label states it can be sprinkled on food. So

can be taken in capsule form with food too I suppose. Why do you

suppose the P.D.needs to be taken on an empty stomach & the K.D.

doesn't since they're both for the same purpose?

==>It is considered " ideal " to take probiotics on an empty stomach

but you can take them with meals too. I, personally, don't believe

it makes much difference.

Bee

[Guest guest]

Caroline wrote:

>

> I have Kyo-Dophilus...acidophilus, bifidum, longum. One capsules =

1.5 billion cells. Are " cells " the same as " units " ? Should I be taking

10,000 " cells " per day?

==>The number of active cells and number of units are the same.

Bee

>

[Guest guest]

I see, then, the other strains are obtained from the fermented drink such as

rejuvelac?

In any case, it's nice to know I can take it/them with meals.

Thanx muchly,

Caroline

From: " Bee Wilder "

> ==>You do not have to get all of the strains in order for it to be

> effective implanting in the bowels. The strains contained in cabbage

> rejuvelac and lactobacllilus capsules and powders are fine.

>>

==>It is considered " ideal " to take probiotics on an empty stomach but you

can take them with meals too.

[Guest guest]

It's good to know the terms & amounts. Then I know I'm ingesting stuff

correcly. Your 'veteran' input sure helps a lot.

Thanx & blessings,

Caroline

From: " Bee Wilder "

>> I have Kyo-Dophilus...acidophilus, bifidum, longum. One capsules = 1.5

>> billion cells. Are " cells " the same as " units " ? Should I be taking 10,000

>> " cells " per day?

>

> ==>The number of active cells and number of units are the same.>

> Bee

[Guest guest]

>

> I see, then, the other strains are obtained from the fermented drink

such as

> rejuvelac?

==>No, you don't need the other strains.

Bee

[Guest guest]

K...thx Bee.

C

From: " Bee Wilder " >

> ==>No, you don't need the other strains.

[Guest guest]

I'm not Bee, but I am a regular customer of Lucy's Kitchen Shop, and have

tried the Lyosan probiotics she offers.

If you can handle dairy-based probiotics, than you can certainly use the

Lyosan acidophilus supplements Lucy's Kitchen Shop carries. Lots of people

use Lyosan acidophilus.

I found I couldn't handle them, as my stomach and immune system objects to

the dairy-base (skim milk powder). I switched to a non-dairy acidophilus

from Kirkman Labs. Other people I know use probiotics from Custom

Probiotics, and from GIHealth. I'm on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, so I

use just the one strain of probiotics, acidophilus.

Kim M.

[Guest guest]

>

> are yogart probiotic pills made from dairy ok?

==>Get non-dairy based probiotics my dear. Cabbage rejuvelac is the

very best probiotic in the world.

Bee