Re: Exercise Restrictions

[Guest guest]

Bonnie,

I had impingement( what sort and name I can't remember) about four months after revision, while still in my TLSO brace. I was sitting in my Ford Areostar, trying to click the seatbelt which was behind me and heard a large thud, and had immediate awful pain. Went and saw Kumar, and he sent me to physical therapy. At therapy, I did ultrasound treatments with some kind of topical medication, and some deep pinpoint massage. It hurt like the dickens, and did it for about three months, but my range of motion returned, and the pain sure lessened. My therapist said it was only time till my other shoulder would give me fits, and true enough within the year the other did. Therapy again but shorter as this one wasn't as bad. Truly it would hurt on and off for about four years, especially when the weather changed, but now, I'm not bothered by it. My elbows alas are still a struggle, can ache pretty good at the end of the day. I think and this is only my experience, that my stiff torso does overwork my arms, and with age, and that, something has to give under the stress. As in all things post revision, there maybe new challenges, sore arms, for me sometimes my right hip. You have sure been through it especially since you had a recovery from your wrist surgery and now this! Here's hoping surgery is the very last resort, and therapy will do you some good. For me it took time, but it got me sooooo much better that what hurting I had left was really minor to what I had in the beginning, totally manageable. For my shoulders after they got the pain really reasonable, I did very light exercise, as I couldn't do much since I was still healing from the revision. When getting a therapist you need one who is very experienced with spines, mine was terrific, and she kept an ongoing conversation going with Kumar during my treatment. You are in my thoughts!

[ ] Exercise Restrictions

Hi Everyone,

Well, I now have Subacromial Impingement & Bursitis in my right shoulder and Biceps Tendonitis as well in my right arm. (I had an MRI after two cortisone injections that provided only temporary relief of the pain in my right upper arm.) The most frustrating part of this new problem is that what helps my back is bad for my shoulder and visa versa. For instance, lying down has always been my best way to alleviate any back pain, but lying down makes my shoulder very painful. Anyway, the doc wants me to have surgery, but I have no intention of going through yet another long recovery period. He said recovery could take up to a year. At my suggestion, we are going to try PT.

I am pretty certain that shoulder PT usually involves weights and some sort of exercise with a machine involving a pulley type thing where you pull down from up above, to strengthen the shoulder. Needless to say, I am leery about any exercise that could harm my back. Have any of you post revision folks been advised to avoid any particular movements, like the one I described above?

Thanks for any info you can give me.

Bonnie

PS, I can't help but wonder whether my curves, surgeries, hardware, cervical spine deterioration and/or kyphosis are the root cause of this shoulder problem.

[Guest guest]

Hi Bonnie,

I am sorry you are facing yet another new painful problem. I have not

had experience in this particular regard, but I did go to my bible on

water exercise to see what she said about the sholder area. The book I

am referencing is called " Water Exercise, 78 safe and effective

exercises for fitness and therapy " , written by Martha White. It is

arguably considered one of the " bibles " of water based therapy. In

Chapter 11 entititled " Shoulder " she says that rotator cuff strains or

impingement can result from muscle imbalances, or from faulty posture

that leads to muscle imbalance. She also notes that rotator cuff

strain may result from decreased vascularity, or blood flow to that

area which is related to advancing age....and thus gives rise to

degenerative changes.

In a further paragraph White notes that " besides strenghtening and

resolving muscle imbalances around the shoulder complex, proper

posture is equally important in avoiding rotator cuff strains or

dysfunction. With a rotator cuff strain, or any other dysfunctional

shoulder condition, one must avoid the posture the body will

subconsciously seek out--that of holding the arm flexed and cradled

across the chest. Avoid this posture, it only compounds the

dysfunction. At night, when pain or discomfort may be signifigant

enough to wake you, do the following: Prop the arm on 1-2 pillows when

lying on your uninvolved side so that the involved arm is properly

supported. This should help twith the discomfort by preventing the

involved shoulder from falling forward across the shest into the

forbidden posture. "

The water exercises White demonstrates in diagrams for beginners to

shoulder therapy do not appear to my untrained eye to hold any

particular risk for our fused spines....but as always, a well trained

PT in aquatic therapy would be the best source for making this

determination.

When I visited Martha last fall we hung out in her clubs deep water

warm water therapy pool and she was working on her shoulder areas,

perhaps she will have some information....I beleive she was treated

for frozen shoulder.

I do agree with you that it seems like the muscle imbalances and

postural problems linked to our scoliosis are probably the underlying

problem for many of us. You are certainly not the first of us to have

problems in the shoulder area....add the likelihood for increased

degenerative changes above our fusions and I would say we would be

lucky to escape without shoulder troubles!

Sorry to be advertising the " aquatic solution " again....but you know

by now that that is always my first thought. If you want me to send

you a link to the Amazon page for ordering this book, just let me know!

I think you are on the right track in putting of surgery on the back

burner until you are sure that there is not a less invasive solution.

Take Care, Cam

[Guest guest]

Hi and Cam,

As usual, you two have been extremely helpful, and I am grateful. Cam, I found the Amazon page for the water exercise book and ordered it right away. Everything you both said made perfect sense to me. As for my back being a contributing factor to my shoulder problems, well, I keep thinking of that old song with the words something like "the knee bone's connected to the thigh bone, the thigh bone's connected to the....." I'm sure you know what I mean. The spine affects so much. Actually, I am surprised that my shoulders have taken this long to "complain" about the spine, muscles, tendons, ligaments and whatever being out of place and/or over used. Oh, well. I'll let you know what happens after I see the physical therapist.

Thanks again,

Bonnie

[Guest guest]

Bonnie,

I hope the boook helps you. Had you already gotten the advice to use

a pillow to support your arm while laying down? I thought that sounded

like it might offer you a little relief for very little effort.

Hope you have your PT soon...looking forard to hearing what she says.

Take Care, Cam

[Guest guest]

Hi Everyone and yes, I'm still around.

Just wanted to jump in here and mention something that a chiropractor friend mentioned to me, especially when I was complaining about my shoulders. With the back being fused, the muscles do not get the workout that they normally would so they eventually start to shorten, thus causing the aches & /or pain in the shoulder, even the arms & hands. The way he had explained it to me, made perfect sense. For me, even if there's no cure/solution, just knowing what is wrong is a big help than dealing with an unknown, because then I know what I am fighting.

Take care,

Llweyn

From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of BonnieSent: December 7, 2008 4:50 PM Subject: [ ] Re: Exercise Restrictions

Hi and Cam,

As usual, you two have been extremely helpful, and I am grateful. Cam, I found the Amazon page for the water exercise book and ordered it right away. Everything you both said made perfect sense to me. As for my back being a contributing factor to my shoulder problems, well, I keep thinking of that old song with the words something like "the knee bone's connected to the thigh bone, the thigh bone's connected to the....." I'm sure you know what I mean. The spine affects so much. Actually, I am surprised that my shoulders have taken this long to "complain" about the spine, muscles, tendons, ligaments and whatever being out of place and/or over used. Oh, well. I'll let you know what happens after I see the physical therapist.

Thanks again,

Bonnie

[Guest guest]

HI Cam,

I figured out on my own. few weeks ago, that a small pillow under my arm while laying down helps tremendously. I had my first PT session today and the PT also recommended using the pillow. (Now, in addition to my regular head pillow, I have in bed with me the pillow for my shoulder, a special one to support my neck and yet another one for between my knees when I sleep on my side. Ridiculous number of pillows!!)

I had my first therapy session today, which went very well. The therapist did agree with me that my thoracic and cervical issues play a part in this rotator cuff issue. It's her opinion that PT will decrease some of the inflammation and thus put me in a better place to withstand surgery and post surgical rehab. She thinks surgery is unavoidable because there is a bone spur which, in her opinion, will eventually result in a big rotator cuff tear if I don't take care of it via surgery now. Apparently, torn rotator cuff surgery is much harder on the patient than the surgery I need now. This is also what the surgeon said. He said recovery from the surgery he is suggesting should take 6 months, but if there is a big rotator cuff tear, full recovery would take a year. Also, the physical therapist thinks my doc does not suggest surgery unless it's really necessary. Of course, all this has me bummed as I really, really do not want surgery. There's no harm is me trying PT for 6-8 weeks before making up my mind about having the surgery. Of course, I'll be doing more and more research about the risks before I agree to any surgery. One interesting thing: the Physical Therapist said that my shoulder problem would be much worse now if I had not been doing the neck stretches and shoulder exercises that I've been doing for years to improve my posture and neck flexibility.

No matter what, I am determined that absolutely nothing will stop me from going to the '09 Retreat.

Bonnie

[Guest guest]

I tore my rotator cuff shortly after revision surgery and spent 5

months in physical therapy (5 days per week for the first month and 3

days per week for the next four months). I did keep in touch with Dr

Bridwell's office to make sure I wasn't doing anything harmful and I

took a photo of my xrays to physical therapy and told them I couldn't

lift weights over head or do anything that would compromise my fusion.

I actually was able to do the pulleys overhead. I just made sure to

put my back against the wall and not do any twisting. I was also

able to work with weights while laying down.

I still have some pain when I sleep on that side too long, but my

doctor was amazed at how much range of motion I was able to get back.

>

> Hi Everyone,

>

> Well, I now have Subacromial Impingement & Bursitis in my right

shoulder and Biceps Tendonitis as well in my right arm. (I had an

MRI after two cortisone injections that provided only temporary

relief of the pain in my right upper arm.) The most frustrating

part of this new problem is that what helps my back is bad for my

shoulder and visa versa. For instance, lying down has always been my

best way to alleviate any back pain, but lying down makes my shoulder

very painful. Anyway, the doc wants me to have surgery, but I have

no intention of going through yet another long recovery period. He

said recovery could take up to a year. At my suggestion, we are

going to try PT.

>

> I am pretty certain that shoulder PT usually involves weights and

some sort of exercise with a machine involving a pulley type thing

where you pull down from up above, to strengthen the shoulder.

Needless to say, I am leery about any exercise that could harm my

back. Have any of you post revision folks been advised to avoid any

particular movements, like the one I described above?

>

> Thanks for any info you can give me.

>

> Bonnie

>

> PS, I can't help but wonder whether my curves, surgeries, hardware,

cervical spine deterioration and/or kyphosis are the root cause of

this shoulder problem.

>

[Guest guest]

Bonnie,I was having a lot of shoulder and upper arm pain and it

turned out the cause was cervical stenosis/herniated

discs......Donna:

>

> Hi Everyone,

>

> Well, I now have Subacromial Impingement & Bursitis in my right

shoulder and Biceps Tendonitis as well in my right arm. (I had an

MRI after two cortisone injections that provided only temporary relief

of the pain in my right upper arm.) The most frustrating part of

this new problem is that what helps my back is bad for my shoulder and

visa versa. For instance, lying down has always been my best way to

alleviate any back pain, but lying down makes my shoulder very

painful. Anyway, the doc wants me to have surgery, but I have no

intention of going through yet another long recovery period. He said

recovery could take up to a year. At my suggestion, we are going to

try PT.

>

> I am pretty certain that shoulder PT usually involves weights and

some sort of exercise with a machine involving a pulley type thing

where you pull down from up above, to strengthen the shoulder.

Needless to say, I am leery about any exercise that could harm my

back. Have any of you post revision folks been advised to avoid any

particular movements, like the one I described above?

>

> Thanks for any info you can give me.

>

> Bonnie

>

> PS, I can't help but wonder whether my curves, surgeries, hardware,

cervical spine deterioration and/or kyphosis are the root cause of

this shoulder problem.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Bonnie:

I do not have anything to add in terms of medical info - but I did want to chime in and say that I am sorry you are having this new issue and to thank you for always sharing what you are dealing with Post Revision...

Take care and I hope you can prolong needing more surgery and get some lasting relief!!

Ken.

From: Donna <nursedonnadlct@...>Subject: [ ] Re: Exercise Restrictions Date: Thursday, December 11, 2008, 7:23 PM

Bonnie,I was having a lot of shoulder and upper arm pain and itturned out the cause was cervical stenosis/herniateddiscs......Donna:>> Hi Everyone,> > Well, I now have Subacromial Impingement & Bursitis in my rightshoulder and Biceps Tendonitis as well in my right arm. (I had anMRI after two cortisone injections that provided only temporary reliefof the pain in my right upper arm.) The most frustrating part ofthis new problem is that what helps my back is bad for my shoulder andvisa versa. For instance, lying down has always been my best way toalleviate any back pain, but lying down makes my shoulder verypainful. Anyway, the doc wants me to have surgery, but I have nointention of going through yet another long recovery period. He saidrecovery could take up to a year. At my suggestion, we are going totry PT. > > I am pretty certain that shoulder PT usually

involves weights andsome sort of exercise with a machine involving a pulley type thingwhere you pull down from up above, to strengthen the shoulder. Needless to say, I am leery about any exercise that could harm myback. Have any of you post revision folks been advised to avoid anyparticular movements, like the one I described above? > > Thanks for any info you can give me.> > Bonnie> > PS, I can't help but wonder whether my curves, surgeries, hardware,cervical spine deterioration and/or kyphosis are the root cause ofthis shoulder problem.>

[Guest guest]

Hi Donna,

Please tell me how it was determined that your shoulder/arm issues were a result of cervical stenosis/herniated discs. What tests were done? And what did you do about your shoulder/arm pain? How are you now?

Thanks.

Ken, thanks for your good wishes.

Bonnie

[Guest guest]

Bonnie,I was diagnosed with a CT/Myelogram,had surgery 10/04 (see my

post titled SURVIVING MORE SURGERY for the specifics)....Donna

>

> Hi Donna,

>

> Please tell me how it was determined that your shoulder/arm issues

were a result of cervical stenosis/herniated discs. What tests were

done? And what did you do about your shoulder/arm pain? How are you now?

>

> Thanks.

>

> Ken, thanks for your good wishes.

>

> Bonnie

>