Re: One week and counting (My experience so far)

[Guest guest]

> I'VE BEGUN PLAYING WITH WALFORDS DIET PROGRAM. It seems kind of a

> pain, having to create a food-list every day which I then need to

> bring in to the day's log. Also, the list of foods is really lame

> for a vegan/healh food oriented person. Are most CRon-folk really

> just junk-food-junkies on starvation diets? You'd think the FIRST

> things which would go if you need to be nutrient dense and have a

> healh focus, would be most of the pre-packaged crapola foods.

I think the problem is that it is based on the USDA database and

therefore you get a lot of info on packaged foods whose calories you

could already know by reading the package and many of whose nutrients

are limited anyway. Meanwhile the database is certainly lacking info

on some healthy whole foods.

> Does anyone have a database of more healthful (hopefully more vegan

> friendly) foods for this program?

No, and I wonder what ever happened to the CR society idea to add

more foods to the DWIDP database ...

>How many of you use this program?

yes i use it sometimes - it's real advantage it that it sharpens your

knowledge and intuition on foods and their general nutrient contents

[Guest guest]

> It's now been 8 days since I began my " calorie " /fat/insulin

> restriction. It's been remarkably easy (hardly even hungry or

> tempted so far) and my average blood sugars are surely the best

> they've been in 33 years. If it doesn't get any harder, I think I

> could do this indefinitely.

Hi Steve,

Sounds like you've got some serious problems with your insulin system

if you're resorting to pharmaceuticals. Maybe they're wise in the

short-term, but I can certainly imagine the possibility that a

solution can be found in an appropriate diet. I don't know much

about this stuff myself, but lately it seems to be the hot topic

everywhere I turn. I've gotten the impression that a high-fat diet

is the best game in town for someone with these problems. I'm

certainly not qualified to advise you to take this approach, but I

definitely advise you to seriously investigate this issue and compare

opposing viewpoints. I recently read a pretty good book

called " Life Without Bread " that has some stimulating discussions

relevant to your problems. It's typical of nutrition books in being

severely one-sided and doggedly pushing a narrow (but potentially

profound) thesis (in this case: " eat lots of animal fat and

protein " ), but it could be very important counterbalanced against

other viewpoints. There are lots of readily available and nutrient-

dense fat sources, like eggs, cream/butter, beef, nuts, sesame seeds,

olives, avocados, coconut, etc, so this seems like a viable route.

I don't have any health problems to speak of, so I've never had any

occasion to experiment with any of these macronutrient issues myself,

but I've been finding it fascinating to read about, and I can't help

but catch a whiff of the nutritional zeitgeist. Personally I like to

compare as many opposing viewpoints as I can find and then generally

take the middle-road of balance, moderation, and variety. Low-fat

and/or vegan is definitely NOT consistent with this approach...

> Does anyone have a database of more healthful (hopefully more vegan

> friendly) foods for this program? How many of you use this

program?

> Do you share food nutrition and recipe databases?

I haven't played around with Walford's software, but you'll probably

get more data from the USDA site (http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/cgi-

bin/nut_search.pl), which is what I like to use. It's the best I've

found so far despite the lack of data for many dozens of valuable

foods and nutrients. I like to do everything manually to develop an

intuition for the numbers.

Considering that humans have been around for many thousands of years

without these sorts of problems with the particular fuel system

that's running amok in your body, and that neither low-fat nor vegan

diets have any historical precedent outside of the 20th century, I

can't help but have the feeling that you might eventually have to

choose between your health and some ideological fads. I'm not very

knowledgeable about any of this; I'm just sharing my honest thoughts.

> I need to get a few scales for weighing food! Should I just get an

> electronic office scale from Staples?

When I looked into the whole food scale thing, I wound up just

getting a cheap (around $50) digital scale (brand name Salter) from a

local kitchen store because I didn't want to shell out a few hundred

bucks for the better (?) ones I found on the internet. Also, I could

never make any sense out of Walford's scale recommendations although

I did try; I'm not a laboratory scientist, just a simple guy. I

don't know how accurate my scale is, but it seems to be adequate for

my purposes, especially for larger quantities. I weigh everything

religiously, but I realize that accuracy is meaningless beyond a

certain level. In the end, if my scale says 7g of cinnamon bark,

will it ever matter if it was actually 5g or 9g?

Let us know how things go!

Mike

[Guest guest]

You have to take the data from the database and make your own if you really want one.

The DWIDP gives use basic data, but it doesn't tell you what you might select and what combinations to use.

Regards.

----- Original Message -----

From: somejoanne2002 <bhsnz@...>

Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 8:10 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: One week and counting (My experience so far)

> I'VE BEGUN PLAYING WITH WALFORDS DIET PROGRAM. It seems kind of a > pain, having to create a food-list every day which I then need to > bring in to the day's log. Also, the list of foods is really lame > for a vegan/healh food oriented person. Are most CRon-folk really > just junk-food-junkies on starvation diets? You'd think the FIRST > things which would go if you need to be nutrient dense and have a > healh focus, would be most of the pre-packaged crapola foods.I think the problem is that it is based on the USDA database and therefore you get a lot of info on packaged foods whose calories you could already know by reading the package and many of whose nutrients are limited anyway. Meanwhile the database is certainly lacking info on some healthy whole foods.> Does anyone have a database of more healthful (hopefully more vegan > friendly) foods for this program? No, and I wonder what ever happened to the CR society idea to add more foods to the DWIDP database ...>How many of you use this program? yes i use it sometimes - it's real advantage it that it sharpens your knowledge and intuition on foods and their general nutrient contents

[Guest guest]

> It's now been 8 days since I began my " calorie " /fat/insulin

> restriction. It's been remarkably easy (hardly even hungry or

> tempted so far) and my average blood sugars are surely the best

> they've been in 33 years. If it doesn't get any harder, I think I

> could do this indefinitely.

For the scale - someone else posted about a relatively inexpensive

Salton - I think it must be the same one I have, and it is most

likely adequate for your purposes. You might also look at

http://www.kingarthurflour.com/ (no affil'n, etc.) which has two

scales (open the catalog and search for 'scale'), one of which (the

Polder) purportedly measures in 1g increments. It only has a 4 lb.

limit, and the other has an 11 lb. limit (5g increment). If you tend

to make larger batches of things, and want to be able to dump into a

largish bowl, the " Baker's Dream Scale " which has a 5g increment like

the Salton, will likely suit you better.

As for the higher-fat diet recommendations, well, the ADA for years

recommended a diet that was highish in fat, and whatever the cause, I

believe the rate of heart disease in older diabetics (who would

likely have been following the ADA recommendations) is kind of high.

I'm not sure you want to continue to be a 'mouse' in that experiment.

Iris