Re: Respect for Hunger

[Guest guest]

suz: thanks for sharing this sad story. The sensation of hunger is a sign

of health. Indeed, we lose it when we're ill, dying, or otherwise in

extremis, such as depressed etc.

on 5/11/2003 11:42 AM, Suzanne Cart at massuz@... wrote:

> I met a most unusual woman yesterday, whose story might be relevant to this

> list. She is , 33 years old and the sister of my friend , whose

> family convened at 's house for Mother's Day. I wandered over merely to

> meet 's new puppy, but soon became involved in conversation with ,

> who was very open and willing to discuss her physical condition. She has

> devoted the past several years of her life to counseling anorectics in

> recovery.

>

> can no longer eat. She has existed for many years with a permanent

> feeding tube. She carries her liquid diet within a backpack, and is often

> reminded by her family to feed herself. She agrees that it's a miracle she

> has survived. would like to eat, but she is no longer able to do so.

> She explained that in the early years of anorexia, she would eat less food.

> Then she began to eat less often...then less and less often.

>

> I told her that must have required tremendous discipline, but she explained

> that over a period of years, it became progressively. All sensations of

> hunger disappeared, along with all emotional connections to food. As this

> liberation progressed, the day arrived when she not only felt better for not

> eating, but became physically sick when she did eat. Today, she is physically

> and completely incapable of eating--hence the tube feeding.

>

> I found it most enlightening to hear about the progression of this illness

> first-hand. Sometimes we've discussed how to define the lines that keep CR

> and anorexia in their respective boxes. was unfamiliar with CR, but

> after hashing over our conversation, I believe the difference between our two

> mindsets might be in our attitudes toward hunger. I just gained new respect

> for mine.

>

> Suz

>

[Guest guest]

> suz: thanks for sharing this sad story. The sensation

of hunger is a sign

> of health. Indeed, we lose it when we're ill, dying, o

r otherwise in

> extremis, such as depressed etc.

>

The story of Suzzane is quite said.

A pitifal to individuals prone to psicologial

disorders. We have to age to live longer. That's the

truth. The best way to die young is to starve to death.

Indeed, I don't feel hunger anymore.

A diet of 1600 kcal/day over these

3 years made it desapered.

I also felt the same thing mentioned: Only feel good

when I refused to eat, but I eat despite of this. And

plan to aways have some abdominal fat, what sometimes

male anoretics refuse to have.

Why?

Because you continue to experience the

effects of dietary restriction as your weight go

down and down and you hurt yourself (self injury,

you know?). Anoretics (unhappily)

are unaware of this pitifal.

So people: keep your eyes opened, and consult you

phisician to check your health.

Even if you are scientists. Discuss with

people. Don't be alone in the world.

Thanks Suzzane. Very nice post!

-- Gandhi.

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[Guest guest]

Hello Kyberneticist (a name I can not pronounce!) and CR ALL:

A good point you make. CRON when properly performed a la Walford,

requires you to absolutely remain healthy and NON-OBSESSED.

Body weight, nourishment, nutrition, state of health, and

so forth must all be monitored by a physician according to

the strict guidelines layed out in Walford's books designed

to ensure safety for the general public.

But who follows the guidelines? That's the problem.

When people deviate -- you know what happens: They are deviant!

And so Suz's warning is a good reminder to us all, to protect

our health and be reasonable in a " non-obsessive " manner.

But even obsessed people think they are reasonable -- and that is

really the problem, isn't it? So we need reminders, and possibly

SEVERE reminders, with graphic stories and tragic examples to

clearly depict the possible disaster consequences.

Who wants to try CR, and sacrifice their life early in a

failed attempt? And as sure as we are living now, it's going

to happen to some, who will end up to be dead early.

There are famous CR researchers, as illustrious as Dr. Walford,

who sincerely believe that CR for humans does not make sense.

J. Masoro (famous in CR research like Dr. Walford),

has endorsed the " CR = impractical for humans " public position

in a recent CR review article published in the 28 Feb 2003 issue

of SAGE KE, the anti-aging section of Science magazine.

Was I shocked when I read this position? No -- because even the

National Academy of Sciences converges on this general conclusion,

based on the statistical percentage of failures occurring during

unsuccessful attempts by " wanna-be " human CR practitioners.

So danger and failure are the red-flags that signal you will have

to be extra SPECIAL in some way to avoid a failed attempt at CR.

Suz's reminder is entirely appropriate. It is far better to fail

at CR, then to be in mortal danger you can not recover from.

-- Warren

==================== ==================== =====================

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Kyberneticist [mailto:kyberneticist@...]

> Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 9:03 PM

>

> Subject: Re: [ ] Respect for Hunger

--- Suzanne Cart <massuz@...> wrote:

> I found it most enlightening to hear about the

> progression of this illness first-hand. Sometimes

> we've discussed how to define the lines that keep CR

> and anorexia in their respective boxes. was

> unfamiliar with CR, but after hashing over our

> conversation, I believe the difference between our

> two mindsets might be in our attitudes toward

> hunger. I just gained new respect for mine.

I've never felt any strong hunger, personally, so I'm

a little defensive about it being an anorexia danger.

Seems that even with no hunger, if you structure your

diet, you'll keep eating. The repulsion seems a

bigger deal, and that's presumably psychological?

Actually, I was kind of thinking something like CRON

might *help* anorexics, assuming they can get past the

feeling physically ill around food.

A diet gives people something to obsess about. And it

is a diet that is still guaranteed to keep one in

health while staying way down on the eeeevil food.

And on the plus side, guarantees proper nutrition.

A lot of the symptoms of anorexia seem to be nutrition

related, although IAMNA(physician or psychiatrist )