Yes, it hurts to be a trout

[Guest guest]

I don't know if plants feel pain when they're slaughtered, but I'm certain many animals die a fearful, gruesome death to satisfy our appetites. It saddens me, but we all have to eat. As we sit down to dinner, author Reynolds* recommends thanking the plants and animals that have given their lives to become our food. This is probably the entire pitiful extent of my spirituality, but it's something that feels very right when I remember to do it.

Suz

*On Reynolds, Morita and Naikan therapies, start out at http://www.todoinstitute.org/cl.html .

[Guest guest]

I agree, Annie, but I would also ask that the plant not be destroyed. Bahia grass is being used in India. And we have producers of wheat grass concentrates. To really reduce the wasted plants we'd need to switch to a method that doesn't ill up everything else in the soil. Tilling is also destructive perhaps moreso than grazing cattle. I've observed land that has been grazed for many years without obvious degradation. There's also a large amount of land that cannot be used for anything but grazing due to lack of rain.

I'm a lacto-veg.

Regards

----- Original Message -----

From: annie_fox

Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 9:47 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: Yes, it hurts to be a trout

> Hi All, Some of us practicing CR feel animals feeling pain is a distinction> from plants, as do vegetarians who do not eat fish. Actually, it's perfectly possible for a vegetarian to believe plants feel pain similarly to animals. It would still make sense to be vegetarian because any animal that is consumed must have first consumed many more plants to tranfer the same amount of energy to a person that a person could get more efficiently by eating plants directly.Of course, most vegetarians probably do not think about the pain of plants either way, even if they do value the lives of plants.I mention this because one of the most annoying retorts people have when someone mentions being vegetarian is, "Well, don't you care about the plants?" Anyone who truly does, of course, would eat them directly and thus minimize overall plant consumption.- Annie

[Guest guest]

Hello Annie and CR ALL:

It is lovely to have people who are sensitive to the pain

of other living creatures: animal, plant, and even our

environment, since Planet Earth Biosphere has an existence

and life all of its own.

One of the benefits of CR is that when we cut back our

calories, we can reduce damage to the entire chain of life.

And we humans are at the end of that life chain. We are

ultimately reducing damage to ourselves too by practicing CR!

This is a beautiful concept.

We need to be reminded about this. Thank you!

This is actually a surprising aspect of CR, isn't it?

A benefit that we perhaps should endorse and support

more enthusiastically. Sensitive people who deeply

care can see it perfectly.

And they may perhaps be the best ones with courage to

step out openly, daring to declare that we are all

interdependent, and we must all try to live in peace,

within ourselves, with ourselves, and with others.

And " Others " is more comprehensive than we may realize.

As caring people, we can reach out and teach the world

with our practice of a CR lifestyle. CR is an immense

benefit to ALL OTHERS -- and benefits us directly too.

-- Warren

> On 30 April 2003, Annie_fox [mailto:annie_fox@...] wrote:

>

> >

> > Hi All, Some of us practicing CR feel animals feeling pain

> > is a distinction from plants, as do vegetarians who do not

> > eat fish.

>

> Actually, it's perfectly possible for a vegetarian to believe

> plants feel pain similarly to animals. It would still make sense

> to be vegetarian because any animal that is consumed must have

> first consumed many more plants to transfer the same amount of

> energy to a person that a person could get more efficiently by

> eating plants directly.

>

> Of course, most vegetarians probably do not think about the pain

> of plants either way, even if they do value the lives of plants.

>

> I mention this because one of the most annoying retorts people

> have when someone mentions being vegetarian is, " Well, don't

> you care about the plants? " Anyone who truly does, of course,

> would eat them directly and thus minimize overall plant consumption.

>

> - Annie

[Guest guest]

From: " annie_fox " <annie_fox@y...>

Date: Thu May 1, 2003 12:17 am....

>I mention this because one of the most annoying retorts people have when

someone mentions being vegetarian is, " Well, don't >>you care about the

plants? " Anyone who truly does, of course, would eat them directly and thus

minimize overall plant >>>>>>consumption.

Hi All, Fruitarians do not eat living plants at all for the truly committed.

Cheers, Al.

Alan Pater, Ph.D.; Faculty of Medicine; Memorial University; St. 's, NL

A1B 3V6 Canada; Tel. No.: (709) 777-6488; Fax No.: (709) 777-7010; email:

apater@...

[Guest guest]

Hello CR ALL:

Al is correct for sure. There are some plants that are unharmed

by picking or harvesting. And for some, the human consumption

actually benefits the plant or fruit itself, by helping the

seedling babies begin life afresh with new opportunities,

widespread elsewhere, in more new locations.

Thanks Al! You are very creative.

-- Warren

=========================== ================= =============

From: Alan Pater [mailto:apater@...]

Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 3:12 PM

Hi All, Fruitarians do not eat living plants at all for the truly

committed.

Cheers, Al.

Alan Pater, Ph.D.; Faculty of Medicine

Memorial University; St. 's, NL

A1B 3V6 Canada

Tel. No.: (709) 777-6488

Fax No.: (709) 777-7010

email: apater@...

> From: " annie_fox " <annie_fox@y...>

> Date: Thu May 1, 2003 12:17 am....

>

>

> I mention this because one of the most annoying retorts

> people have when someone mentions being vegetarian is,

> " Well, don't >>you care about the plants? "

> Anyone who truly does, of course, would eat them

> directly and thus minimize overall plant consumption.

> ----------------------- ------------------ -------------------