Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 So I was on the natural thyroid group and someone said that if the adrenal are not working properly it will make T3 pool in the blood and not be absorbed properly. Do you know this to be true? Which they say could be why my FT3 numbers were high other than the fact that I took my Armour that morning of the test. I saw my doctor yesterday and he reduced my Armour to 2 grains a day rather than the 2/3 split during the week. I guess I am willing to try this but then after reading this about the adrenals, I am not sure I agreed to the right treatment. We will do blood test in 4 weeks and I am to take my Armour that morning again, like I did the last time. Also we will be doing a saliva cortisol test at that time. I felt good about this when I got home but now reading about the adrenal blood pooling, I am no sure. What a roller-coaster! Venizia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 Venizia, You wrote: > So I was on the natural thyroid group and someone said that if the > adrenal are not working properly it will make T3 pool in the blood and > not be absorbed properly. ... Pretty meaningless gibberish to me. T3 is dissolved in the blood. How can the solute " pool " in the solvent? Even as a metaphor, it is weak. FT3 freely diffuses in and out of your cells. Only the bound fraction requires help. If adrenal hormones change the concentration of binding enzymes, that might change the amount of FT3 that reaches the cells, but it still does not involve pooling. Lots of things affect that binding, including stress and starvation (dieting). Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 Venizia, You wrote: > So I was on the natural thyroid group and someone said that if the > adrenal are not working properly it will make T3 pool in the blood and > not be absorbed properly. ... Pretty meaningless gibberish to me. T3 is dissolved in the blood. How can the solute " pool " in the solvent? Even as a metaphor, it is weak. FT3 freely diffuses in and out of your cells. Only the bound fraction requires help. If adrenal hormones change the concentration of binding enzymes, that might change the amount of FT3 that reaches the cells, but it still does not involve pooling. Lots of things affect that binding, including stress and starvation (dieting). Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 > If adrenal hormones change the concentration of binding enzymes, that might change the amount of FT3 that reaches the cells, but it still does not involve pooling. Lots of things affect that binding, including stress and starvation (dieting). > > Chuck > How does one know if the adrenal hormones change the concentration of binding enzymes. Venizia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 Chuck, The following two posting from myself and Janie at naturalthyroidhormones in regard to your response about pooling of t3. I very much appreciate what you have to say. This is very important to me to understand and I want to get it right. Would you please respond to me regarding her response? I really hate to put this on you with all you are dealing with in your personal life but I do appreciate it more than I can say. Thanks, Venizia Hi Venizia. Not sure which " hypo T " group you are talking about (and it's okay if I don't know, as I am not in competition with anyone and not here to bash any other group.) But pooling is definitely a reality. The proof is in the high blood free T3 result! When your cortisol is low, you WILL have high levels of T3 hanging out in your blood and not making it to your cells with accompanying hypo symptoms. It's all here: www.stopthethyroidm adness.com/ adrenal-info And no, this has nothing to do with " we are all different. " It has to do with a reality that thyroid patients with low cortisol have experienced over and over. But...even with that being said, I support you where you feel you need to go for the time being. You'll eventually figure it out. And when it's time for you to deal with the adrenal problem, we'll be here for you. Or even better, the NTH Adrenals group will be there for you. Janie > > I am not taking this lightly and your post does concern me. When I > brought up the idea of pooling at the hypo T group, a person on it, > that is VERY knowledgeable, says there is no pooling that goes on with > the T3, he said it dissolves in the blood. So, as you can see this can > be very confusing to someone like me that is new to all of this and > all the approaches to dealing with this disease. So with the > conflicting comments, I am willing to go along with my doctor for now. > > Don't get me wrong, I truly value what this group offers. I just have > to take everything into account and we are all different. > > Venizia - > > > Venizia, > > You wrote: > > So I was on the natural thyroid group and someone said that if the > > adrenal are not working properly it will make T3 pool in the blood and > > not be absorbed properly. ... > > Pretty meaningless gibberish to me. T3 is dissolved in the blood. How can the solute " pool " in the solvent? Even as a metaphor, it is weak. FT3 freely diffuses in and out of your cells. Only the bound fraction requires help. > > If adrenal hormones change the concentration of binding enzymes, that might change the amount of FT3 that reaches the cells, but it still does not involve pooling. Lots of things affect that binding, including stress and starvation (dieting). > > Chuck > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 the way you are dosing is a sign to me that your adrenals need support--most hypothyroids do. you will spend months and years doing " tests " and then hopefully at some point you will finally get what you need. that's what happened to me. Enough Armour, enough iodine! and companion nutrients, and cortef made a huge difference for me. have you looked at Hertoghe's book Hormone Solutions? why not do thyroid test and take Armour afterwards? that's what most peeps do. Gracia So I was on the natural thyroid group and someone said that if the adrenal are not working properly it will make T3 pool in the blood and not be absorbed properly. Do you know this to be true? Which they say could be why my FT3 numbers were high other than the fact that I took my Armour that morning of the test. I saw my doctor yesterday and he reduced my Armour to 2 grains a day rather than the 2/3 split during the week. I guess I am willing to try this but then after reading this about the adrenals, I am not sure I agreed to the right treatment. We will do blood test in 4 weeks and I am to take my Armour that morning again, like I did the last time. Also we will be doing a saliva cortisol test at that time. I felt good about this when I got home but now reading about the adrenal blood pooling, I am no sure. What a roller-coaster! Venizia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 uh-oh I am not Chuck! but I think you are making things too complicated. you could always just do the saliva testing for adrenals or try cortef. for sure try DHEA. yes I know some ppl will tell you this is very scary but it is not. Gracia Chuck, The following two posting from myself and Janie at naturalthyroidhormones in regard to your response about pooling of t3. I very much appreciate what you have to say. This is very important to me to understand and I want to get it right. Would you please respond to me regarding her response? I really hate to put this on you with all you are dealing with in your personal life but I do appreciate it more than I can say. Thanks, Venizia Hi Venizia. Not sure which " hypo T " group you are talking about (and it's okay if I don't know, as I am not in competition with anyone and not here to bash any other group.) But pooling is definitely a reality. The proof is in the high blood free T3 result! When your cortisol is low, you WILL have high levels of T3 hanging out in your blood and not making it to your cells with accompanying hypo symptoms. It's all here: www.stopthethyroidm adness.com/ adrenal-info And no, this has nothing to do with " we are all different. " It has to do with a reality that thyroid patients with low cortisol have experienced over and over. But...even with that being said, I support you where you feel you need to go for the time being. You'll eventually figure it out. And when it's time for you to deal with the adrenal problem, we'll be here for you. Or even better, the NTH Adrenals group will be there for you. Janie > > I am not taking this lightly and your post does concern me. When I > brought up the idea of pooling at the hypo T group, a person on it, > that is VERY knowledgeable, says there is no pooling that goes on with > the T3, he said it dissolves in the blood. So, as you can see this can > be very confusing to someone like me that is new to all of this and > all the approaches to dealing with this disease. So with the > conflicting comments, I am willing to go along with my doctor for now. > > Don't get me wrong, I truly value what this group offers. I just have > to take everything into account and we are all different. > > Venizia - > > > Venizia, > > You wrote: > > So I was on the natural thyroid group and someone said that if the > > adrenal are not working properly it will make T3 pool in the blood and > > not be absorbed properly. ... > > Pretty meaningless gibberish to me. T3 is dissolved in the blood. How can the solute " pool " in the solvent? Even as a metaphor, it is weak. FT3 freely diffuses in and out of your cells. Only the bound fraction requires help. > > If adrenal hormones change the concentration of binding enzymes, that might change the amount of FT3 that reaches the cells, but it still does not involve pooling. Lots of things affect that binding, including stress and starvation (dieting). > > Chuck > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 I am taking the thyroid test the same way I took it 2 weeks ago. I forgot and took armour the day of the test, so he is telling me the next time, in 4 weeks, to take the armour again before the test and we will see what the numbers are. He wants to see where the numbers end up with the reduced dose and taking armour before the test. Venizia > > > why not do thyroid test and take Armour afterwards? that's what most peeps do. > Gracia > > So I was on the natural thyroid group and someone said that if the > adrenal are not working properly it will make T3 pool in the blood and > not be absorbed properly. Do you know this to be true? Which they say > could be why my FT3 numbers were high other than the fact that I took > my Armour that morning of the test. > > I saw my doctor yesterday and he reduced my Armour to 2 grains a day > rather than the 2/3 split during the week. I guess I am willing to > try this but then after reading this about the adrenals, I am not sure > I agreed to the right treatment. We will do blood test in 4 weeks and > I am to take my Armour that morning again, like I did the last time. > Also we will be doing a saliva cortisol test at that time. > > I felt good about this when I got home but now reading about the > adrenal blood pooling, I am no sure. What a roller-coaster! > > Venizia > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 Gracia, No problem with you responding. I just wanted to get Chucks attention because we had been discussing this topic. My DHEA was high - 659 with high end of range 4-- something. so I do not think I need it. I am going to do the saliva test the next appt. Thanks, Venizia -- In hypothyroidism , " Gracia " <circe@...> wrote: > > > uh-oh I am not Chuck! but I think you are making things too complicated. you could always just do the saliva testing for adrenals or try cortef. for sure try DHEA. > yes I know some ppl will tell you this is very scary but it is not. > Gracia > > > > Chuck, > > The following two posting from myself and Janie at > naturalthyroidhormones in regard to your response about pooling of t3. > I very much appreciate what you have to say. This is very important > to me to understand and I want to get it right. Would you please > respond to me regarding her response? I really hate to put this on > you with all you are dealing with in your personal life but I do > appreciate it more than I can say. > > Thanks, Venizia > > Hi Venizia. Not sure which " hypo T " group you are talking about > (and it's okay if I don't know, as I am not in competition with anyone > and not here to bash any other group.) But pooling is definitely a > reality. The proof is in the high blood free T3 result! When your > cortisol is low, you WILL have high levels of T3 hanging out in your > blood and not making it to your cells with accompanying hypo symptoms. > It's all here: www.stopthethyroidm adness.com/ adrenal-info > > And no, this has nothing to do with " we are all different. " It has to > do with a reality that thyroid patients with low cortisol have > experienced over and over. > > But...even with that being said, I support you where you feel you need > to go for the time being. You'll eventually figure it out. And when > it's time for you to deal with the adrenal problem, we'll be here for > you. Or even better, the NTH Adrenals group will be there for you. > Janie > > > > I am not taking this lightly and your post does concern me. When I > > brought up the idea of pooling at the hypo T group, a person on it, > > that is VERY knowledgeable, says there is no pooling that goes on with > > the T3, he said it dissolves in the blood. So, as you can see this can > > be very confusing to someone like me that is new to all of this and > > all the approaches to dealing with this disease. So with the > > conflicting comments, I am willing to go along with my doctor for now. > > > > Don't get me wrong, I truly value what this group offers. I just have > > to take everything into account and we are all different. > > > > Venizia > > - > > > > > > Venizia, > > > > You wrote: > > > So I was on the natural thyroid group and someone said that if the > > > adrenal are not working properly it will make T3 pool in the blood and > > > not be absorbed properly. ... > > > > Pretty meaningless gibberish to me. T3 is dissolved in the blood. > How can the solute " pool " in the solvent? Even as a metaphor, it is > weak. FT3 freely diffuses in and out of your cells. Only the bound > fraction requires help. > > > > If adrenal hormones change the concentration of binding enzymes, > that might change the amount of FT3 that reaches the cells, but it > still does not involve pooling. Lots of things affect that binding, > including stress and starvation (dieting). > > > > Chuck > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 DHEA was high by blood test? this is what we were discussing b4-----DURRANT PEATFIELD SAYS HIGH DHEA IS AN INDICATOR THAT ADRENALS NEED CORTEF. Gracia Gracia, No problem with you responding. I just wanted to get Chucks attention because we had been discussing this topic. My DHEA was high - 659 with high end of range 4-- something. so I do not think I need it. I am going to do the saliva test the next appt. Thanks, Venizia -- Recent Activity a.. 17New Members Visit Your Group Health Healthy Aging Improve your quality of life. Meditation and Lovingkindness A Group to share and learn. Share Photos Put your favorite photos and more online. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 24, 2008 Report Share Posted May 24, 2008 Venizia, You wrote: > > The following two posting from myself and Janie at > naturalthyroidhormones in regard to your response about pooling of t3.... Cortico steroids, including cortisol, definitely affect T4 to T3 conversion. Thus, high cortisol levels are associated with relatively higher T4 to lower T3 levels. However, I have never read that cortisol insufficiency was associated with excess FT3, or that high serum FT3 was bad. To the contrary, FT3 is usually touted as the best indicator of overall thyroid and metabolic function. It is also usually described as the best indicator of how much T3 is " getting into the cells, " although that is another common misnomer, since cell walls are permeable to FT3. I suggest you ask the other list for archival literature supporting this unusual description. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 24, 2008 Report Share Posted May 24, 2008 Yes it was a blood test. My doctor said that high DHEA is not necessarily bad. When people get older it is preferred that the DHEA is on the high side. All the conflicting information is really hard for me to handle. I am sure I do not know what to believe anymore. Even it I do my own research, how do I know it is credible. :( Venizia > > > DHEA was high by blood test? > this is what we were discussing b4-----DURRANT PEATFIELD SAYS HIGH DHEA IS AN INDICATOR THAT ADRENALS NEED CORTEF. > Gracia > > Gracia, > > No problem with you responding. I just wanted to get Chucks attention > because we had been discussing this topic. > > My DHEA was high - 659 with high end of range 4-- something. so I do > not think I need it. > > I am going to do the saliva test the next appt. > > Thanks, > Venizia > > -- > Recent Activity > a.. 17New Members > Visit Your Group > Health > Healthy Aging > > Improve your > > quality of life. > > Meditation and > Lovingkindness > > A Group > > to share and learn. > > Share Photos > Put your favorite > > photos and > > more online. > . > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 24, 2008 Report Share Posted May 24, 2008 Venizia, You wrote: > > > How does one know if the adrenal hormones change the concentration of > binding enzymes. It is very well studied and documented that they do. Just Google a bit. What the other list is claiming is that a lack of adrenal hormones causes FT3 to accumulate in the blood and not get into the cells. That is different from binding. Very different, which is why I would ask for some documentation of that claim. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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