Re: Caspian Sea Yogurt doesn't ferment anymore!

[Guest guest]

It's pretty common to have that happen, actually, esp. if you are

using raw milk. Raw milk has it's own set of bacteria, which may

or may not be compatible with the cultures you are adding.

It's kinda like planting a garden pot. If you use soil from the yard,

it will have seeds in it, and those seeds will sprout, and your

pot will have whatever was growing in your yard. Some seeds

sprout really fast in those conditions, like fireweed, so for me,

I'll always get a pot of fireweed. Which will crowd out whatever

it was I was planting. So when I plant in a pot, I use sterilized soil.

Raw milk also contains something called bacteriophages. Phages

are in the air too ... they are all over. They are viruses that attack

bacteria. Sooner or later they attack your " pet " bacteria and

wipe out the culture. Some bacteria are extremely phage-resistant

though (kefir being one) and even " host " the phages to wipe

out competing bacteria.

Anyway, if you want a specific taste or type of yogurt, such

as caspian sea, you should keep some in the freezer to

" recover " from emergencies. And/or sterilize the milk

before you start. In the old days they used local bacteria

to make the yogurt ... which was probably what came

with the milk anyway. But even if you do that, the taste

will change. And the yogurt or cheese changed depending

on the local bacteria, which is why cheeses are named

after towns. Cheese in one town tasted different than

in another town. These days they use lab-grown cultures

so you can make various cheeses no matter where you live.

I pretty much just use my own culture ... kefiili ... which

is very robust and used to my kitchen. It doesn't work with

raw milk though, at least not the local raw milk here.

On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 8:34 AM, mk4201 <moozy21@...> wrote:

> and others,

>

> I received a bit of CSY from a friend and was making it with raw milk.

> It was very thick and delicious for a few weeks. Suddenly this week, it

> stopped culturing the raw milk. The only change has been the warmer

> weather.

>

> I thought of something you posted once, , about the weaker

> strains in yogurt needing the milk to be heated in order to survive and

> thrive. Do you think this is what happened? they eventually all petered

> out? The same exact thing happened to my friend's CSY that sent it to

> me at the same exact time, which would validate this theory. Or could

> it be the " spring " raw milk? or another factor?

>

> Finally, is it worth trying to keep a yogurt culture and having to heat

> up milk when it's so easy to just make raw milk kefir? I am pondering

> this as well... thanks for your thoughts and help,

>

> Millie

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

For simplicity you could just make kefir from your raw milk. When I read

these mails I sometimes think -- I should make yoghurt -- but kefir is

just so easy and undemanding. Mine loves raw milk and hasn't done

anything except reproduce since I had it

Sally

[Guest guest]

I should probably add that kefir is *traditionally* made from raw

milk and does fine with it. It can, and will, change, depending

on the type and season of the milk. Dom talks about this a lot on

his website. My own kefir is kefiili, which has a thick viili bacteria

in it, which is somewhat more picky than the Caucus native kefir,

which is well-nigh indestructible (iodine or cow-antibiotics can

kill it, but it's not easy to do).

Kefir is wonderful stuff. Very healthy. Ridiculously easy. It is not

thick, however, like

yogurt, so if that is what you want/need then you need a different

process.

On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 9:34 AM, Eva family <bobsallyeva@...> wrote:

> For simplicity you could just make kefir from your raw milk. When I read

> these mails I sometimes think -- I should make yoghurt -- but kefir is

> just so easy and undemanding. Mine loves raw milk and hasn't done

> anything except reproduce since I had it

> Sally

>

>

[Guest guest]

Mine is thick like double cream before you beat it -- that is it pours

very slowly but it is definitely pouring not breaking or falling like

solid yoghurt -- maybe the consistency of a thick drinking yoghurt. Is

that right?

Sally

[Guest guest]

Mine is thick like double cream before you beat it -- that is it pours

very slowly but it is definitely pouring not breaking or falling like

solid yoghurt -- maybe the consistency of a thick drinking yoghurt. Is

that right?

Sally

[Guest guest]

I don't know what regular kefir is like. Mine is NOT regular

kefir. It is extremely thick and " ropey " . It will not go through

say, a strainer, at all. But it was, long ago, contaminated

by a viili culture, and they really, really seem to like each

other.

On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 11:31 PM, Eva family <bobsallyeva@...> wrote:

> Mine is thick like double cream before you beat it -- that is it pours

> very slowly but it is definitely pouring not breaking or falling like

> solid yoghurt -- maybe the consistency of a thick drinking yoghurt. Is

> that right?

> Sally

>

[Guest guest]

My method is

to boil raw milk to 75-80 C degree with small bubbles.

Cool to warm temperature around 40 C.

Maintain regular yogurt at 28 C or your confortable condition.

if kefir, 3C degree lower than that.

if Caspian Sea Yogurt/ Matuoni, 3 C degree lower than that of kefir.

hope this helps,

isao

[Guest guest]

Thanks Isao,

I will follow your method with yogurt from here on. I live and learn ; )

millie