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hmmm... I've read Lee's book

" What your doctor may not tell you about menopause "

and I'm taking the cream he recommends in that book

So... that must be old info aye?

This is building up in my system?

:/

----- Original Message -----

From: " CountryGirl " <ruthful@...>

< >

Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 1:49 AM

Subject: Re: Creatine

> Hi . I hear ya. You might consider looking up Ray Peats site. He

has an oral progesterone that doesn't build up in the system. I did

progesterone cream " Purgest " (doesn't have any artificial chemicals in it)

for several years at a very low dose and didn't notice anything negative. I

do know women who use large amounts many times a day and don't take a break.

I don't think that is wise.

>

> I always pray and ask for wisdom with these things and it works for me.

>

> Another factor for many women is removing all the things in their home

that increase estrogen. Scented candles, air fragrances, plastic. When

you make your enviroment as natural as you can you will have less high

estrogen and less bone loss.

>

> I have a friend who has had horrific hot flashes. Then she went on

vacation in the woods for a week and didn't have one hot flash. A light

bulb moment. She quit her job at Napa (petroleum products are major

offenders) and her flashed went down by half. She has reduced fake stuff in

home and reduced them further but not completely.

>

> Blessings

> Donna

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: Evely

>

> Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 12:09 PM

> Subject: Re: Creatine

>

>

> I am taking natural progest daily

> Then I read " progesterone creams reconsidered " from WAP site

> http://www.westonaprice.org/women/natural_protection.html

>

> man... it's just so hard to know what to do. Whenever you think you are

> doing the right thing along comes something else that contraindicates it

:/

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: " CountryGirl " <ruthful@...>

> < >

> Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 12:03 AM

> Subject: Re: Creatine

>

>

> > Hi . Yes, I know the basic science behind it. I just didn't get

the

> boost they said I would. That doens't mean that you wouldn't.

> >

> > But, for osteoporosis, progesterone is a major player. And green

foods

> like supergreens. I think I posted here that some people are getting as

> much as 11% increase in bone mass over a year. Seems remarkable to me.

I

> am taking some that a friend sent and I have noticed that I seem to need

> less coral calcium now. ??? Time will tell.

> >

> > Blessings

> > Donna

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: Evely

> >

> > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 11:44 AM

> > Subject: Re: Creatine

> >

> >

> > Thank you Donna for your thoughts

> > ~I know isolated is probably not the best thing but the reason I had

> even

> > considered it to begin with is that I read an article on

osteoporosis

> and it

> > said creatine is a very good thing because it increases the fluid

inside

> the

> > muscle cells~ with increased strength could then exercise harder

and

> longer

> > thus putting stress on bones even more and increasing bone mass

even

> more

> > etc.

> >

> > BTW I am 27 years old with osteo

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: " CountryGirl " <ruthful@...>

> > < >

> > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 11:31 PM

> > Subject: Re: Creatine

> >

> >

> > > Hi Jen,

> > >

> > > I took it years ago and found it to not be all it was cracked up

to

> be.

> > And over the years I have come to the belief that people don't know

as

> much

> > as they think they do and when they set about to isolate ingredients

> instead

> > of using whole products, you are asking for trouble. What they

don't

> know

> > about how it affects the body long term can be a real problem. Over

and

> > over I have seen new info come out about isolated products that say,

> okay

> > now we know that's not a good plan.

> > >

> > > If you are looking for energy increase and an increase in muscle

mass

> from

> > a whole foods product, rather than an ioslated ingredient, I would

> suggest

> > pure organic colostrum.

> > >

> > > With cfs I was unable to exercise and my calf musles became mostly

non

> > existent. Then I found colostrum and after just a few months of

daily

> > intake without exercise I had fabulous calf muscles. Many other

> benefits,

> > of course, but those are other topics.

> > >

> > > Blessings

> > > Donna

> > > http://www.excellentthings.net

> > > ----- Original Message -----

> > > From: Evely

> > >

> > > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 6:42 AM

> > > Subject: Creatine

> > >

> > >

> > > Does anyone here take creatine for sports training?

> > > I was considering taking but someone told me it breaks down the

> kidneys

> > and

> > > liver and causes electrolyte imbalance

> > >

> > > Advice please

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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At 02:24 AM 2/13/03 -0800, you wrote:

>And I keep in mind that women in other countries don't experience the kind of

meno symptoms that American women do and I try to live a life that is un

American in diet and enviroment and it seems to be working. 

>

>Stumbling around in semi darkness,  Smile

>Donna

Have read that before and also that our diets " used " to be higher in

progesterone from food. In Dr. Lee's hormone test I found about a year ago

before giving up all soy I had signs of low progesterone and high estrogen.

That helped along with my more recent increase of fat in my diet. Did write

JimDuke when his database didn't turn up sources of progesterone other than

wild yam that I knew. Needed the precursor diosgenin. Here's two messages he

sent me along with an abstract

Lee says thousands of plants contain progesterone. I don't think he's

right. Neither does my datbase. Many plants contain diosgenin which the

chemist (and some few, perhaps optimistic, think the human body) converts to

progesterone. Diosgnein is the chemical precurosor to many hormones

including testosterone and progesterone. Most chemists and physiologists say

the plants don't make it and the human body does not convert disogenin to

progesterone.

Dietary legumes and crucifers, formely more important in the diet, are rich

in phytoestrogens if not progesterone.

Hi Wanita

Some more miscellany re progesterone. More re progestins.

?The following abstracts, to me, makes the clover seem better than soy for

self medicating women

(without being sure whether they are short of pregestin or estrogen), if

they are trying (herbally)

to get their hormones in balance. I looked up the abstract after readings

what Alan Tillostson said

re the article. Of 150 herbs tested for estrogen and progesterone activity,

only red clover, thyme

and turmeric exhibited high levels of both Such a balance of activities

might be more beneficial

than herbs which exhibit only estrogenic activity. " Progesterone deficiency

is as much a problem

for menopausal women as estrogen deficiency. " (AKT, 2001). Curried clover

here I come!.

..

Zava DT, Dollbaum CM, Blen M. 1998. Estrogen and progestin bioactivity of

foods, herbs, and

spices. Proc Soc Exp Biol Med 1998 Mar;217(3):369-78 .

In this study we report on the content and bioactivity of plant (phyto)

estrogens and progestins in

various foods, herbs, and spices, before and after human consumption. Over

150 herbs

traditionally used by herbalists for treating a variety of health problems

were extracted and tested

for their relative capacity to compete with estradiol and progesterone

binding to intracellular

receptors for progesterone (PR) and estradiol (ER) in intact human breast

cancer cells. The six

highest ER-binding herbs that are commonly consumed were soy, licorice, red

clover, thyme,

tumeric, hops, and verbena. The six highest PR-binding herbs and spices

commonly consumed

were oregano, verbena, tumeric, thyme, red clover and damiana. Some of the

herbs and spices

found to contain high phytoestrogens and phytoprogestins were further tested

for bioactivity

based on their ability to regulate cell growth rate in ER (+) and ER (-)

breast cancer cell lines and

to induce or inhibit the synthesis of alkaline phosphatase, an end product

of progesterone action,

in PR (+) cells. In general, we found that ER-binding herbal extracts were

agonists, much like

estradiol, whereas PR-binding extracts, were neutral or antagonists. The

bioavailability of

phytoestrogens and phytoprogestins in vivo were studied by quantitating the

ER-binding and PR-

binding capacity of saliva following consumption of soy milk, exogenous

progesterone,

medroxyprogesterone acetate, or wild mexican yam products containing

diosgenin. Soy milk

caused a dramatic increase in saliva ER-binding components without a

concomitant rise in

estradiol. Consumption of PR-binding herbs increased the progestin activity

of saliva, but there

were marked differences in bioactivity. In summary, we have demonstrated

that many of the

commonly consumed foods, herbs, and spices contain phytoestrogens and

phytoprogestins that

act as agonists and antagonists in vivo. PMID9492350

Jianghua Liu, Joanna E. Burdette, Haiyan Xu, Chungang Gu, B. van

Breemen, Krishna

P. L. Bhat, Booth, s I. Constantinou, M. Pezzuto, Harry H.

S. Fong, Norman

R. Farnsworth, and Judy L. Bolton. 2001. Evaluation of Estrogenic Activity

of Plant Extracts for

the Potential Treatment of Menopausal Symptoms. J. Agric. Food Chem.

49(5):2472-2479.

Abstract:

Eight botanical preparations that are commonly used for the treatment of

menopausal symptoms

were tested for estrogenic activity. Methanol extracts of red clover

(Trifolium pratense L.),

chasteberry (Vitex agnus-castus L.), and hops (Humulus lupulus L.) showed

significant

competitive binding to estrogen receptors alpha (ERalpha) and beta

(ERbeta). With cultured

Ishikawa (endometrial) cells, red clover and hops exhibited estrogenic

activity as indicated by

induction of alkaline phosphatase (AP) activity and up-regulation of

progesterone receptor (PR)

mRNA. Chasteberry also stimulated PR expression, but no induction of AP

activity was

observed. In S30 breast cancer cells, pS2 (presenelin-2), another

estrogen-inducible gene, was

up-regulated in the presence of red clover, hops, and chasteberry.

Interestingly, extracts of Asian

ginseng (Panax ginseng C.A. Meyer) and North American ginseng (Panax

quinquefolius L.)

induced pS2 mRNA expression in S30 cells, but no significant ER binding

affinity, AP

induction, or PR expression was noted in Ishikawa cells. Dong quai [

sinensis (Oliv.)

Diels] and licorice (Glycyrrhiza glabra L.) showed only weak ER binding and

PR and pS2

mRNA induction. Black cohosh [Cimicifuga racemosa (L.) Nutt.] showed no

activity in any of

the above in vitro assays. Bioassay-guided isolation utilizing ER

competitive binding as a

monitor and screening using ultrafiltration LC-MS revealed that genistein

was the most active

component of red clover. Consistent with this observation, genistein was

found to be the most

effective of four red clover isoflavones tested in the above in vitro

assays. Therefore, estrogenic

components of plant extracts can be identified using assays for estrogenic

activity along with

screening and identification of the active components using ultrafiltration

LC-MS. These data

suggest a potential use for some dietary supplements, ingested by human

beings, in the treatment

of menopausal symptoms.

Introduction

During the period of menopause and postmenopause, many women experience one

or more

symptoms such as hot flashes, depression, mood swings, sleeping disorders,

vaginal dryness, and

joint pain, largely due to a lack of estrogens (1). Hormone replacement

therapy has helped to

relieve menopausal symptoms; in addition, the risk of osteoporosis,

cardiovascular disease,

dementia from Alzheimer's disease, and certain types of cancer are reduced

(2-5).

Epidemiological data show that a diet rich in phytoestrogens, such as those

found in soy, reduce

the number of hot flashes and the incidence of cancer in Oriental women (6).

Since side-effects

of traditional estrogen replacement therapy include a slight but significant

increase in the risk of

developing breast and endometrial cancer (3, 7-10), women are increasingly

using herbal

remedies as alternative therapy (11-13).

Estrogen regulates gene expression by binding to intracellular estrogen

receptors (ER), which

influence the growth, differentiation, and function of many target tissues.

When estrogens bind to

an ER, receptor dimerization occurs, which in turn binds to an

estrogen-responsive element

(ERE) in the DNA of estrogen-sensitive cells (14). Consequently, the ER-ERE

complex

modulates the transcription of estrogen-regulated target genes, such as the

progesterone receptor

(PR) and presenelin-2 (pS2), and ultimately stimulates cell growth and

differentiation (15).

The differences between the two estrogen receptors (ERalpha and ERbeta)

include tissue

distribution and ligand specificity (16, 17). In the midgestational human

fetus, ER is most

abundant in the uterus, and smaller quantities have been detected in the

ovaries, testes, skin, and

gut by semiquantitative reverse transcriptase-polymerase chain reaction

(RT-PCR). In contrast,

high amounts of ERbeta mRNA are present in fetal ovaries, testes, adrenals,

and spleen (18).

Both ERalpha and ERbeta are coexpressed in the human central nervous system,

breast,

cardiovascular tissue, and bone (19).

Black cohosh [Cimicifuga racemosa (CR)], red clover [Trifolium pratense L.

(TP)], hops

[Humulus lupulus L. (HL)], and chasteberry [Vitex agnus-castus L. (VA)] are

four of the most

frequently used herbs in Western countries for menopausal symptoms or

premenstrual syndrome

(PMS) (6, 20-22). Dong quai [ sinensis (Oliv.) Diels (AS)] is a

common Chinese herb

used for women's health, and licorice (Glycyrrhiza glabra L.) has been

reported to have both

estrogenic and antiestrogenic activities (23, 24). Several case reports

implicate Asian ginseng

[Panax ginseng C.A. Meyer (PG)] as a possible candidate for the treatment of

menopause (25,

26). In addition, the stimulation of the estrogen-sensitive gene, pS2, by

North American ginseng

[Panax quinquefolius L. (PQ)] has been shown (27, 28).

Dear Dr. Bolton:

Interesting your estrogenic evaluation paper in the last issue of JAFC. I

regret only that you did not have the soy (and kudzu) in there to compare

with the other 8

possibly estrogenic plants you studied. Based on the ERalpha-binding

activity, the red clover

seems to be ca 5 times more potent than hops and 8 times more potent than

chasteberry

I am unable to fathom from the data, whether the IC50's of the estrogenic

isoflavones in clover,

0.3 uM for genistein, 17 for daidzein, 35 for biochanin, and 104 for

formononetin, would suggest

that synergy would be indicated by the IC50 for the methanolic extract of

the red clover.(5.6

ug/ml) for ERalpha binding activity. I suppose that could be determined if I

knew how mcu of

each isoflavone was present in the extract

But clearly it suggests that the genistein content would be of greatest

predictive value for that

ERalpha-binding activity.

PROGESTERONE

Mannan, A and Ahmad, K. 1978. Preliminary study of sex hormones of medical

importance in

bangladeshi plants. BMRC Bull. 4(2):78- In to me unintelligible units and in

an unconvincing

paper, these Bangladesh scientist speak of estradiol, progesterone and

testosterone in

Heliotropium indicum, Phyllanthus biruri, and Synedrela nodiflora. I do not

trust their data

enough to move it into my database. They quote other sources saying that

progesterone has been

reported in appleseed but their citation is a bit deficient as well.

(Gawienowski, A.M. and Gilbs;

C.C. Steroids, 12: 45 1968) (An(A

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Just an affirmation here regarding country girl's post.

Definitely read Ray's info on progesterone. Also

I have worked with women both who have used cream and Ray Peat's

Progesterone in Vitamin E oil. And without any question, hands

down, no comparison Ray's product is infinitely more successful and

useful. Some women have had a hard time finding it, if you can't

find it just drop me and email and I'll be happy to send you some.

DMM

www.cedarcanyonclinic.com

mmarasco@...

ps- be certain you need progesterone before you use it. Just

throwing hormones into your body without excellent reason is not a

great idea.

--- In , " Evely " <je@h...>

wrote:

> hmmm... I've read Lee's book

> " What your doctor may not tell you about menopause "

> and I'm taking the cream he recommends in that book

> So... that must be old info aye?

> This is building up in my system?

> :/

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: " CountryGirl " <ruthful@p...>

> < >

> Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 1:49 AM

> Subject: Re: Creatine

>

>

> > Hi . I hear ya. You might consider looking up Ray Peats

site. He

> has an oral progesterone that doesn't build up in the system. I

did

> progesterone cream " Purgest " (doesn't have any artificial

chemicals in it)

> for several years at a very low dose and didn't notice anything

negative. I

> do know women who use large amounts many times a day and don't

take a break.

> I don't think that is wise.

> >

> > I always pray and ask for wisdom with these things and it works

for me.

> >

> > Another factor for many women is removing all the things in

their home

> that increase estrogen. Scented candles, air fragrances,

plastic. When

> you make your enviroment as natural as you can you will have less

high

> estrogen and less bone loss.

> >

> > I have a friend who has had horrific hot flashes. Then she went

on

> vacation in the woods for a week and didn't have one hot flash. A

light

> bulb moment. She quit her job at Napa (petroleum products are

major

> offenders) and her flashed went down by half. She has reduced

fake stuff in

> home and reduced them further but not completely.

> >

> > Blessings

> > Donna

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: Evely

> >

> > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 12:09 PM

> > Subject: Re: Creatine

> >

> >

> > I am taking natural progest daily

> > Then I read " progesterone creams reconsidered " from WAP site

> > http://www.westonaprice.org/women/natural_protection.html

> >

> > man... it's just so hard to know what to do. Whenever you

think you are

> > doing the right thing along comes something else that

contraindicates it

> :/

> >

> >

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: " CountryGirl " <ruthful@p...>

> > < >

> > Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 12:03 AM

> > Subject: Re: Creatine

> >

> >

> > > Hi . Yes, I know the basic science behind it. I just

didn't get

> the

> > boost they said I would. That doens't mean that you wouldn't.

> > >

> > > But, for osteoporosis, progesterone is a major player. And

green

> foods

> > like supergreens. I think I posted here that some people are

getting as

> > much as 11% increase in bone mass over a year. Seems

remarkable to me.

> I

> > am taking some that a friend sent and I have noticed that I

seem to need

> > less coral calcium now. ??? Time will tell.

> > >

> > > Blessings

> > > Donna

> > > ----- Original Message -----

> > > From: Evely

> > >

> > > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 11:44 AM

> > > Subject: Re: Creatine

> > >

> > >

> > > Thank you Donna for your thoughts

> > > ~I know isolated is probably not the best thing but the

reason I had

> > even

> > > considered it to begin with is that I read an article on

> osteoporosis

> > and it

> > > said creatine is a very good thing because it increases

the fluid

> inside

> > the

> > > muscle cells~ with increased strength could then exercise

harder

> and

> > longer

> > > thus putting stress on bones even more and increasing

bone mass

> even

> > more

> > > etc.

> > >

> > > BTW I am 27 years old with osteo

> > > ----- Original Message -----

> > > From: " CountryGirl " <ruthful@p...>

> > > < >

> > > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 11:31 PM

> > > Subject: Re: Creatine

> > >

> > >

> > > > Hi Jen,

> > > >

> > > > I took it years ago and found it to not be all it was

cracked up

> to

> > be.

> > > And over the years I have come to the belief that people

don't know

> as

> > much

> > > as they think they do and when they set about to isolate

ingredients

> > instead

> > > of using whole products, you are asking for trouble. What

they

> don't

> > know

> > > about how it affects the body long term can be a real

problem. Over

> and

> > > over I have seen new info come out about isolated products

that say,

> > okay

> > > now we know that's not a good plan.

> > > >

> > > > If you are looking for energy increase and an increase

in muscle

> mass

> > from

> > > a whole foods product, rather than an ioslated ingredient,

I would

> > suggest

> > > pure organic colostrum.

> > > >

> > > > With cfs I was unable to exercise and my calf musles

became mostly

> non

> > > existent. Then I found colostrum and after just a few

months of

> daily

> > > intake without exercise I had fabulous calf muscles. Many

other

> > benefits,

> > > of course, but those are other topics.

> > > >

> > > > Blessings

> > > > Donna

> > > > http://www.excellentthings.net

> > > > ----- Original Message -----

> > > > From: Evely

> > > >

> > > > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 6:42 AM

> > > > Subject: Creatine

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Does anyone here take creatine for sports training?

> > > > I was considering taking but someone told me it breaks

down the

> > kidneys

> > > and

> > > > liver and causes electrolyte imbalance

> > > >

> > > > Advice please

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

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Hi again. Yes, I used progest for awhile. Then I found Purgest and switched to

it because it doesn't have methyl paraben, etc, in it. Purgest has all natural

ingredients, aloe vera, bio identical progesterone, grapefruit extract, jojoba

oil, natural vit e, ascorbic acid. Compare that with the one you are using and

see what you think. The whole point of a progesterone cream is that the body

does absorb through the skin. So why be putting artificial chemicals on your

skin on a daily basis. If you can avoid it.

I think, basically, that supplementing hormones without getting a saliva test is

playing russian roulet. No offense to the russians. Smile. But I have had to

do that since I haven't had health insurance or private $ to do the testing. So

I err on the side of cautious and super under treat myself and try to judge by

my symptoms or energy. When I didn't " feel " that the cream was working for me I

quit using it and I felt better. Prior to that I felt better on it.

And I keep in mind that women in other countries don't experience the kind of

meno symptoms that American women do and I try to live a life that is un

American in diet and enviroment and it seems to be working. I am 52 and haven't

had a hot flash yet, I wondered if the cream was helping me avoid them, but

when I quit the cream I didn't have any either. So I am thankful.

Stumbling around in semi darkness, Smile

Donna

----- Original Message -----

From: Evely

Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 2:03 PM

Subject: Re: Natural Progesterone

hmmm... I've read Lee's book

" What your doctor may not tell you about menopause "

and I'm taking the cream he recommends in that book

So... that must be old info aye?

This is building up in my system?

:/

----- Original Message -----

From: " CountryGirl " <ruthful@...>

< >

Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 1:49 AM

Subject: Re: Creatine

> Hi . I hear ya. You might consider looking up Ray Peats site. He

has an oral progesterone that doesn't build up in the system. I did

progesterone cream " Purgest " (doesn't have any artificial chemicals in it)

for several years at a very low dose and didn't notice anything negative. I

do know women who use large amounts many times a day and don't take a break.

I don't think that is wise.

>

> I always pray and ask for wisdom with these things and it works for me.

>

> Another factor for many women is removing all the things in their home

that increase estrogen. Scented candles, air fragrances, plastic. When

you make your enviroment as natural as you can you will have less high

estrogen and less bone loss.

>

> I have a friend who has had horrific hot flashes. Then she went on

vacation in the woods for a week and didn't have one hot flash. A light

bulb moment. She quit her job at Napa (petroleum products are major

offenders) and her flashed went down by half. She has reduced fake stuff in

home and reduced them further but not completely.

>

> Blessings

> Donna

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: Evely

>

> Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 12:09 PM

> Subject: Re: Creatine

>

>

> I am taking natural progest daily

> Then I read " progesterone creams reconsidered " from WAP site

> http://www.westonaprice.org/women/natural_protection.html

>

> man... it's just so hard to know what to do. Whenever you think you are

> doing the right thing along comes something else that contraindicates it

:/

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: " CountryGirl " <ruthful@...>

> < >

> Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 12:03 AM

> Subject: Re: Creatine

>

>

> > Hi . Yes, I know the basic science behind it. I just didn't get

the

> boost they said I would. That doens't mean that you wouldn't.

> >

> > But, for osteoporosis, progesterone is a major player. And green

foods

> like supergreens. I think I posted here that some people are getting as

> much as 11% increase in bone mass over a year. Seems remarkable to me.

I

> am taking some that a friend sent and I have noticed that I seem to need

> less coral calcium now. ??? Time will tell.

> >

> > Blessings

> > Donna

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: Evely

> >

> > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 11:44 AM

> > Subject: Re: Creatine

> >

> >

> > Thank you Donna for your thoughts

> > ~I know isolated is probably not the best thing but the reason I had

> even

> > considered it to begin with is that I read an article on

osteoporosis

> and it

> > said creatine is a very good thing because it increases the fluid

inside

> the

> > muscle cells~ with increased strength could then exercise harder

and

> longer

> > thus putting stress on bones even more and increasing bone mass

even

> more

> > etc.

> >

> > BTW I am 27 years old with osteo

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: " CountryGirl " <ruthful@...>

> > < >

> > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 11:31 PM

> > Subject: Re: Creatine

> >

> >

> > > Hi Jen,

> > >

> > > I took it years ago and found it to not be all it was cracked up

to

> be.

> > And over the years I have come to the belief that people don't know

as

> much

> > as they think they do and when they set about to isolate ingredients

> instead

> > of using whole products, you are asking for trouble. What they

don't

> know

> > about how it affects the body long term can be a real problem. Over

and

> > over I have seen new info come out about isolated products that say,

> okay

> > now we know that's not a good plan.

> > >

> > > If you are looking for energy increase and an increase in muscle

mass

> from

> > a whole foods product, rather than an ioslated ingredient, I would

> suggest

> > pure organic colostrum.

> > >

> > > With cfs I was unable to exercise and my calf musles became mostly

non

> > existent. Then I found colostrum and after just a few months of

daily

> > intake without exercise I had fabulous calf muscles. Many other

> benefits,

> > of course, but those are other topics.

> > >

> > > Blessings

> > > Donna

> > > http://www.excellentthings.net

> > > ----- Original Message -----

> > > From: Evely

> > >

> > > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 6:42 AM

> > > Subject: Creatine

> > >

> > >

> > > Does anyone here take creatine for sports training?

> > > I was considering taking but someone told me it breaks down the

> kidneys

> > and

> > > liver and causes electrolyte imbalance

> > >

> > > Advice please

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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  • 2 years later...
Guest guest

Natural progesterone, made from naturally occurring plant sterols, is primarily produced from diosgenin found in wild yam (Dioscorea) roots and soybeans.

Here is a site for some good reading.

http://www.ylcf.org/goodhealth/np-usage.htm

Suzi

What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered.

http://suziesgoats.wholefoodfarmacy.com/

Mobile Take with you! Check email on your mobile phone.

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  • 1 year later...
Guest guest

I have done a lot of study on " natural progesterone " . I am sure that there are

different formulations. The one I use is from Kenogen and is in oil which you

rub on your gums to be

absorbed through them. 3 drops a day gives you 10 mg.

I had previously used natural progesterone cream without any success.

The oil progesterone has done wonders for me. I have been taking it for 2 years

and have such a feeling of wellbeing and lack of the awful depressions I had

before. I have never looked back.

I have read that if you look at this progesterone and progesterone from the

human body through the microscope you wont find any difference.

Our naturopath puts a lot of people on the cream even people with cancer - even

men with cancer.

From what I understand it opposes estrogen which is usually dominant in most

women these days.

A friend with breast cancer uses it along with a lot of other things and has

seen a marked reduction in her breast tumours probably not because of the

progesterone but at least it hasnt accelerated it as your article proposes. She

has estrogen dominant breast cancer.

When a woman is pregnant their body produces enormous amounts of progesterone.

This usually causes a feeling of contentment, better skin, hair and nails.

Often when the progesterone abruptly

ceases on giving birth the woman goes into post natal depression which I believe

could be quickly relieved with doses of natural progesterone.

My daughter and my daughter-in-law have both had their PMT greatly reduced.

Lots of menopausal friends have had their hot flushes stopped or reduced.

I know I am sticking to the Kenogen one which is a bit ignorant of me not to

even read the material you are suggesting (most unlike me - I read absolutely

everything) but nothing will stop me as whenever I " forget " to take for a week

or more I start getting anxiety and not feeling the deep sense of happiness

inside that I get when I take it. If anyone wants to get the progesterone oil (I

think the website would be www.kenogen)I fax through my orders. It is about $22

for 6-12 weeks supply.

Toni

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