Re: my back... now, .making changes

[Guest guest]

So I shall think of Toni too but I cannot nor will not now or ever be selfish enough to put me first.

Do you really think putting yourself first is selfish, Toni? Is it possible that putting yourself first is the most loving thing you can do for yourself and those that care about you? When you first do everything to take responsibility for your own life and truly care about yourself, you can then do more for others. That's like saying "I don't want to be a millionaire because there are others who are broke". The truth is you can help others financially much better if you yourself are loaded!

I believe that selfish people ONLY care about their own needs. Selfless people take care of their needs first and then have lots more energy and resources to lend a hand to others. Just my take on it.

Gloria

[Guest guest]

One thing that is not so greatly emphasized, still, in the West, is

that you cannot seperate the body from the mind and the spirit.

So, starting with any one of those will help. To say that one has to

get one's emotional self in order to be able to make changes may feel

like it is so. But, making physical changes will help with your

emotions.....and your mental outlook....it's all connected.

Do you have one one these emotions as the predominatnt emotion?

Sadness, grief

Anxiety ...depression

Irritability, anger ...on edge, easy to snap

Fear, apprehension

Overthinking, worry, obsession

You can answer privately if you want.

Kit

> Kit,

>

> I rarely go to a doctor. When I finally did go I was in so much

pain for nearly a year that I had trouble walking. He was rude and

sarcastic. He even asked me if I was depressed! Before I left I did

tell him in nice terms of course what I thought of him. I may have

things going on but at 45 years of age I am flexible. I could probably

fare better then alot of 21 year olds out there.

> I refuse to age though my bad habits are doing that for me I guess,

huh? Well, I will be working on that. I just need to get a grip of my

emotional self and not let others berate me so much as they often do.

Well this is taking a whole different turn...lol par for me

>

> Thanks Kit!

>

> Have a fantastic day

> Tone

[Guest guest]

First you change the things you can or are in control of...

What specifically are you asking about (if you wish to say)

suziKathy L <angeldestiny@...> wrote:

How do you change things if they are beyond your control?__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I think everyone has them all to some degree. It's part of the human condition. And I agree it is a 3-fold process - spirit, soul (emotions) and body. I agree to that many physical problems can be caused, started from, or made worse by the things we do, think or our emtional attitudes.

maryTone <tone102@...> wrote:

Oh Kit,

I have them all! hehe..but noone knows anything. As I always say, I never take anything outside this door with me and I always look for the best in everything. I could write a bio and maybe that would explain but then again doubt if anyone would be interested. Maybe if my Mom had not been taken from me so early on, life would have been different. She was such an amazing,beautiful and strong source. The list of adjectives are endless pertaining to her. If you or anyone else met me, you would probably love me. I am friendly and kind,never complain and will give my last cent if it will help someone else. So as nuerotic and screwed up as I am, that exists only in my world. So now that everyone knows I am even weirder then they previously thought...hehe

Thanks Kit

You have a fantastic day

Toni

For the Lord God helps Me; therefore have I not been ashamed or confounded. Therefore have I set My face like a flint, and I know that I shall not be put to shame. Isa 50:7__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Well, I think I see the problem... you've never been to you.(or at least not in a very long time)... It is admirable to help others Toni..(and we or most of us do here, however, we do tend to our health first)... but you need / must first help yourself so that you can continue to help others. It is time Toni looks at herself to help cure herself instead of worrying about everyone else... If this sounds selfish, IT IS.... Toni, no one truly can care about you more or better than yourself. Yes, we all care here on the list... and yes, we can help you , BUT NONE OF US can cure you... YOU have to do that... and maybe this is why you are as you are cause you been too busy worrying and doing for everyone else and forgot about yourself...your health. It is time Toni, to think about yourself.Tone <tone102@...> wrote:

Oh Kit,

I have them all! hehe..but noone knows anything. As I always say, I never take anything outside this door with me and I always look for the best in everything. I could write a bio and maybe that would explain but then again doubt if anyone would be interested. Maybe if my Mom had not been taken from me so early on, life would have been different. She was such an amazing,beautiful and strong source. The list of adjectives are endless pertaining to her. If you or anyone else met me, you would probably love me. I am friendly and kind,never complain and will give my last cent if it will help someone else. So as nuerotic and screwed up as I am, that exists only in my world. So now that everyone knows I am even weirder then they previously thought...hehe

Start your day with - make it your home page

[Guest guest]

Kathy, if they are beyond your control you cannot change them. You can,

however, change your attitude towards them.

Gayla

Always Enough Ranch

Acampo, California

Check out our SALE PAGE at

www.bouncinghoofs.com/alwaysenoughhobbysale.html

A day without Bill Barnhill is like a day without sunshine!

goatclearing@...

http://coloredboers.home.att.net/always.html

No one ever gets far unless he accomplishes the impossible at least once a

day. Elbert Hubbard

----- Original Message -----

From: " Kathy L " <angeldestiny@...>

<health >

Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 10:00 AM

Subject: Re: Re: my back... now, .making changes

How do you change things if they are beyond your control?

Kathy L.

Angeldestiny's Dream Nursery

Romanticsilk Crafts

Please cast your vote for my site on the Top 100

www.romanticsilk.com

----- Original Message -----

From: " kitcurtin " <kitcurtin@...>

<health >

Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 12:56 PM

Subject: Re: my back... now, .making changes

>

> One thing that is not so greatly emphasized, still, in the West, is

> that you cannot seperate the body from the mind and the spirit.

>

> So, starting with any one of those will help. To say that one has to

> get one's emotional self in order to be able to make changes may feel

> like it is so. But, making physical changes will help with your

> emotions.....and your mental outlook....it's all connected.

>

> Do you have one one these emotions as the predominatnt emotion?

>

> Sadness, grief

> Anxiety ...depression

> Irritability, anger ...on edge, easy to snap

> Fear, apprehension

> Overthinking, worry, obsession

>

> You can answer privately if you want.

>

> Kit

>

>

>

> > Kit,

> >

> > I rarely go to a doctor. When I finally did go I was in so much

> pain for nearly a year that I had trouble walking. He was rude and

> sarcastic. He even asked me if I was depressed! Before I left I did

> tell him in nice terms of course what I thought of him. I may have

> things going on but at 45 years of age I am flexible. I could probably

> fare better then alot of 21 year olds out there.

> > I refuse to age though my bad habits are doing that for me I guess,

> huh? Well, I will be working on that. I just need to get a grip of my

> emotional self and not let others berate me so much as they often do.

> Well this is taking a whole different turn...lol par for me

> >

> > Thanks Kit!

> >

> > Have a fantastic day

> > Tone

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Gayla wrote:

> Kathy, if they are beyond your control you cannot change them. You can,

> however, change your attitude towards them.

> Gayla

==================================

Oohhh, most eloquently put Gayla. Very well said indeed.

--

Peace be with you, Gayla.

Don " Quai " Eitner

" Spirit sleeps in the mineral, breathes in the vegetable, dreams in the animal

and wakes in man. "

Nearly all men die of their remedies, and not of their illnesses. ~Jean

Baptiste Molière, Le Malade Imaginaire

The obstacle is the path. ~Zen Proverb

[Guest guest]

I can change them...just not right now (other things need to change first)

and I can't change the way I see it either cause it is what it is and I

cannot make it something it isn't. If I change my attitude about it then

that will make it seem like it is ok......but it is defninitely wrong.I have

been trying to avoid accepting it as being wrong though and that is why I

got so sick and depressed.Things will change eventually but I need to get

healthy first....and figure out how to change it. One thing at a time

though......starting with trying to deal with my agorophobia and going out

to the dentist tonight (I am scared to death and have been having panic

attacks like crazy) the pain I have been from my teeth has take over the

panic though and is causing a huge internal battle....not sure who/what is

winning yet....just hope someone is around to pick up the pieces.....lol

Kathy L.

Angeldestiny's Dream Nursery

Romanticsilk Crafts

Please cast your vote for my site on the Top 100

www.romanticsilk.com

----- Original Message -----

From: " Gayla " <goatclearing@...>

<health >

Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 1:38 PM

Subject: Re: Re: my back... now, .making changes

> Kathy, if they are beyond your control you cannot change them. You can,

> however, change your attitude towards them.

> Gayla

> Always Enough Ranch

> Acampo, California

> Check out our SALE PAGE at

> www.bouncinghoofs.com/alwaysenoughhobbysale.html

> A day without Bill Barnhill is like a day without sunshine!

> goatclearing@...

> http://coloredboers.home.att.net/always.html

> No one ever gets far unless he accomplishes the impossible at least once a

> day. Elbert Hubbard

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: " Kathy L " <angeldestiny@...>

> <health >

> Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 10:00 AM

> Subject: Re: Re: my back... now, .making changes

>

>

> How do you change things if they are beyond your control?

>

>

> Kathy L.

> Angeldestiny's Dream Nursery

> Romanticsilk Crafts

> Please cast your vote for my site on the Top 100

> www.romanticsilk.com

>

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: " kitcurtin " <kitcurtin@...>

> <health >

> Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 12:56 PM

> Subject: Re: my back... now, .making changes

>

>

> >

> > One thing that is not so greatly emphasized, still, in the West, is

> > that you cannot seperate the body from the mind and the spirit.

> >

> > So, starting with any one of those will help. To say that one has to

> > get one's emotional self in order to be able to make changes may feel

> > like it is so. But, making physical changes will help with your

> > emotions.....and your mental outlook....it's all connected.

> >

> > Do you have one one these emotions as the predominatnt emotion?

> >

> > Sadness, grief

> > Anxiety ...depression

> > Irritability, anger ...on edge, easy to snap

> > Fear, apprehension

> > Overthinking, worry, obsession

> >

> > You can answer privately if you want.

> >

> > Kit

> >

> >

> > --- In health , " Tone " <tone102@p...>

wrote:

> > > Kit,

> > >

> > > I rarely go to a doctor. When I finally did go I was in so much

> > pain for nearly a year that I had trouble walking. He was rude and

> > sarcastic. He even asked me if I was depressed! Before I left I did

> > tell him in nice terms of course what I thought of him. I may have

> > things going on but at 45 years of age I am flexible. I could probably

> > fare better then alot of 21 year olds out there.

> > > I refuse to age though my bad habits are doing that for me I guess,

> > huh? Well, I will be working on that. I just need to get a grip of my

> > emotional self and not let others berate me so much as they often do.

> > Well this is taking a whole different turn...lol par for me

> > >

> > > Thanks Kit!

> > >

> > > Have a fantastic day

> > > Tone

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Thanks Suzi:) I hear ya and I am taking steps to improve my life. I found the world of raw foods in Jan 2004 and this wonderful list with such wonderful friends this past winter.

I will never stop putting others before myself though. I have done such since I was a child and I thrive on doing for others. So I shall think of Toni too but I cannot nor will not now or ever be selfish enough to put me first. It is all okay though. I believe I am on this Earth for a reason...LOL just trying to figure the hell out why

Blessings.,

Tone

Well, I think I see the problem... you've never been to you.(or at least not in a very long time)... It is admirable to help others Toni..(and we or most of us do here, however, we do tend to our health first)... but you need / must first help yourself so that you can continue to help others. It is time Toni looks at herself to help cure herself instead of worrying about everyone else... If this sounds selfish, IT IS.... Toni, no one truly can care about you more or better than yourself. Yes, we all care here on the list... and yes, we can help you , BUT NONE OF US can cure you... YOU have to do that... and maybe this is why you are as you are cause you been too busy worrying and doing for everyone else and forgot about yourself...your health. It is time Toni, to think about yourself.

[Guest guest]

well you have to stay healthy long enough to find out why... you're only putting yourself first healthwise so that you can continue to help others. and yes, we're all put here for a reason... some of us are lucky enough to figure or find out why in our lifetimes and others never do figure it out...

SuziTone <tone102@...> wrote:

So I shall think of Toni too but I cannot nor will not now or ever be selfish enough to put me first. It is all okay though. I believe I am on this Earth for a reason...LOL just trying to figure the hell out why

Suzi

What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered.

www.onegrp.com/?mamanott organic cosmetics

http://suziesgoats.wholefoodfarmacy.com/

Start your day with - make it your home page

[Guest guest]

Hi Kathy,

One cannot change things that are beyond one's control. One can only

change and control one's own actions, thoughts and feelings.

I always thought the " Serenity Prayer " was extrememly cool.

" God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change

The courage to change those that I can

And the wisdom to know the difference "

Here's a nice site on making changes.

http://www.learningplaceonline.com/change-intro.htm

:-) Kit

> How do you change things if they are beyond your control?

>

>

> Kathy L.

> Angeldestiny's Dream Nursery

> Romanticsilk Crafts

> Please cast your vote for my site on the Top 100

> www.romanticsilk.com

>

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: " kitcurtin " <kitcurtin@e...>

> <health >

> Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 12:56 PM

> Subject: Re: my back... now, .making changes

>

>

> >

> > One thing that is not so greatly emphasized, still, in the West, is

> > that you cannot seperate the body from the mind and the spirit.

> >

> > So, starting with any one of those will help. To say that one has to

> > get one's emotional self in order to be able to make changes may feel

> > like it is so. But, making physical changes will help with your

> > emotions.....and your mental outlook....it's all connected.

> >

> > Do you have one one these emotions as the predominatnt emotion?

> >

> > Sadness, grief

> > Anxiety ...depression

> > Irritability, anger ...on edge, easy to snap

> > Fear, apprehension

> > Overthinking, worry, obsession

> >

> > You can answer privately if you want.

> >

> > Kit

[Guest guest]

I used to go to alanon and am familiar with the prayer and try to think of

it when things happen. I know I cannot change someone elses actions and am

working on changing my own and getting strong enough to deal with

his.......and there may be some life changes in our future but I cannot look

after 5 kids myself with my health being as bad as it is....so I am working

slowly on fixing that.......or as much as I can.

Somehow I need to deal with the agorophobia and depression so I can prove

that I am not going to lie down and take it any more.

Kathy L.

Angeldestiny's Dream Nursery

Romanticsilk Crafts

Please cast your vote for my site on the Top 100

www.romanticsilk.com

----- Original Message -----

From: " kitcurtin " <kitcurtin@...>

<health >

Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 3:11 PM

Subject: Re: my back... now, .making changes

>

> Hi Kathy,

>

> One cannot change things that are beyond one's control. One can only

> change and control one's own actions, thoughts and feelings.

>

> I always thought the " Serenity Prayer " was extrememly cool.

>

> " God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change

>

> The courage to change those that I can

>

> And the wisdom to know the difference "

>

>

> Here's a nice site on making changes.

>

> http://www.learningplaceonline.com/change-intro.htm

>

> :-) Kit

>

>

>

>

>

>

> > How do you change things if they are beyond your control?

> >

> >

> > Kathy L.

> > Angeldestiny's Dream Nursery

> > Romanticsilk Crafts

> > Please cast your vote for my site on the Top 100

> > www.romanticsilk.com

> >

> >

> >

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: " kitcurtin " <kitcurtin@e...>

> > <health >

> > Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 12:56 PM

> > Subject: Re: my back... now, .making changes

> >

> >

> > >

> > > One thing that is not so greatly emphasized, still, in the West, is

> > > that you cannot seperate the body from the mind and the spirit.

> > >

> > > So, starting with any one of those will help. To say that one has to

> > > get one's emotional self in order to be able to make changes may feel

> > > like it is so. But, making physical changes will help with your

> > > emotions.....and your mental outlook....it's all connected.

> > >

> > > Do you have one one these emotions as the predominatnt emotion?

> > >

> > > Sadness, grief

> > > Anxiety ...depression

> > > Irritability, anger ...on edge, easy to snap

> > > Fear, apprehension

> > > Overthinking, worry, obsession

> > >

> > > You can answer privately if you want.

> > >

> > > Kit

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Toni,

Yes....we all experience them, of course. But the trick is to

determine which is the predominant one...or which is the predominant

one I'm having today....or which is the predominant one I am having

this minute. It is a place to start from.

If I may make an observation....I don't mean to be offensive....but I

mostly hear you putting 'stops' on yourself. I can't do 'this'

without doing 'that' first. It is a good way to get stuck in

'overwhelm'. In this post you say -if your Mom hadn't died when you

were young- which sounds like a horrible, scarring experience for a

young child...she sounds like she was a great Mom and a profound

influence. But it is not productive to think about the what-ifs. It

is an example of what you cannot change. I had some horrible

childhood hardships, my father had even worse....many here probably

have their own terrible tales....we have to work with what we've got.

When you walk out the door you are taking all of yourself.....it is

not possible to leave anything behind. If you are stuffing things

down deep inside, that is not healthy and you may be hiding it from

yourself in the end. And, you may not even be hiding it from others

very well....maybe that Dr. could really see that you were

down-in-the-mouth and thus asked you about depression. Besides, a

person that is 'frozen' in inaction or can't make life-saving changes

are often considered to be depressed. You send your posts in a cheery

manner, which is thoughtful towards the rest of us...but I am far from

hearing the " best " ....things sound pretty bad for you. I am sure you

are a wonderful person when it comes to others but it seems like it is

leaving no energy to care for yourself. Maybe, even, this thinking

about others is a way to not think about yourself and a distraction

from your own needs....some sound urgent. I don't think your Bio

would help the situation, you are not applying for a job, nor applying

to be a friend, we already love you. You know that corny

phrase....today is the first day of the rest of your life....!!!!

No history necessary.

I am only saying these things because they have been advices given to

me. We have had conversations offlist before and there is always a

reason why you cannot take care of yourself. We only care about

YOU...we don't know these other people that you talk about....invite

them to join the list and we can care about them to, but for right now

we only wish the best for you and want to see that you also want the

best for YOU ...no one else matters here, but Y-O-U. :-)

Gosh, I think I just got thru telling someone that I'm not a wordy

person!!! ;-P ;-) Oh well...guess I could have been

wordier...worsier...lol

Love you,

;-)Kit

> Oh Kit,

>

> I have them all! hehe..but noone knows anything. As I always

say, I never take anything outside this door with me and I always look

for the best in everything. I could write a bio and maybe that would

explain but then again doubt if anyone would be interested. Maybe if

my Mom had not been taken from me so early on, life would have been

different. She was such an amazing,beautiful and strong source. The

list of adjectives are endless pertaining to her. If you or anyone

else met me, you would probably love me. I am friendly and kind,never

complain and will give my last cent if it will help someone else. So

as nuerotic and screwed up as I am, that exists only in my world. So

now that everyone knows I am even weirder then they previously

thought...hehe

>

> Thanks Kit

> You have a fantastic day

> Toni

[Guest guest]

One of the reasons I asked is that we ask on patient intake. The

predominant emotion will direct us to the organ system most in need of

attention.

In diagnosis, these emotions have co-relations. We then know how to

proceed with treatment and herbal prescription. Addressing the organ

system will help turn around the emotion, as well. Mind, body, spirit

cannot be seperated, treat one (any one) and the rest will follow.

Kit

> Oh Kit,

>

> I have them all! hehe..but noone knows anything. As I always

say, I never take anything outside this door with me and I always look

for the best in everything. I could write a bio and maybe that would

explain but then again doubt if anyone would be interested. Maybe if

my Mom had not been taken from me so early on, life would have been

different. She was such an amazing,beautiful and strong source. The

list of adjectives are endless pertaining to her. If you or anyone

else met me, you would probably love me. I am friendly and kind,never

complain and will give my last cent if it will help someone else. So

as nuerotic and screwed up as I am, that exists only in my world. So

now that everyone knows I am even weirder then they previously

thought...hehe

>

> Thanks Kit

> You have a fantastic day

> Toni

>

[Guest guest]

and to do this you have to think about you first... ok????

Toni,

Somewhere I think there is a voice inside of you saying that you are selfish if you put yourself first. We are all here to tell you that's not true. Stop believing that old message. You may have never thought of taking care of yourself before you attempt to take care of others. If you can't do that, at least take care of yourself equally. So, if you get a fan for the bird, you get one for yourself too!!! If you order herbs for Peeps, order some for you too. Start with baby steps.

Gloria

[Guest guest]

" other things need to change first "

Not to be glib...but this is the fastest way to stop yourself from

making any changes. I speak from experience.

" I need to get healthy first.... "

If this is the " first " ....you can solve the problem....pick something

you can change, working towards your goal of good health...like Suzi

said " baby steps " ....something you CAN do...something that you can

have success at, no matter how small. Say...I dunno, like drink more

water....keep track if you need to. Mark the number of glasses on

your calendar....after a week look at the progress. See how you feel.

That's what we are all talking about on this list...the path to good

health...you will have our support.

Kit

> I can change them...just not right now (other things need to change

first)

> and I can't change the way I see it either cause it is what it is and I

> cannot make it something it isn't. If I change my attitude about it then

> that will make it seem like it is ok......but it is defninitely

wrong.I have

> been trying to avoid accepting it as being wrong though and that is

why I

> got so sick and depressed.Things will change eventually but I need

to get

> healthy first....and figure out how to change it. One thing at a time

> though......starting with trying to deal with my agorophobia and

going out

> to the dentist tonight (I am scared to death and have been having panic

> attacks like crazy) the pain I have been from my teeth has take over the

> panic though and is causing a huge internal battle....not sure

who/what is

> winning yet....just hope someone is around to pick up the pieces.....lol

>

>

> Kathy L.

> Angeldestiny's Dream Nursery

> Romanticsilk Crafts

> Please cast your vote for my site on the Top 100

> www.romanticsilk.com

>

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: " Gayla " <goatclearing@b...>

> <health >

> Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 1:38 PM

> Subject: Re: Re: my back... now, .making changes

>

[Guest guest]

You can't give away what you don't have first.

Even the airlines say to put the oxygen masks on yourself *first* before anyone else.

Sharyn

From: health [mailto:health ] On Behalf Of MorningGlory113@...Do you really think putting yourself first is selfish, Toni? Is it possible that putting yourself first is the most loving thing you can do for yourself and those that care about you?

--

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.

Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.9/62 - Release Date: 8/2/2005

[Guest guest]

And when you change your thoughts about things that are that you don't want,

you change your point of attraction and are in a position to attract what

you *do* want.

Sharyn

-----Original Message-----

From: health

[mailto:health ] On Behalf Of kitcurtin

One cannot change things that are beyond one's control. One can only change

and control one's own actions, thoughts and feelings.

--

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.

Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.9/62 - Release Date: 8/2/2005

[Guest guest]

Toni,

You may think you do it well, but you are hurting yourself... and think how much more you could do if you got yourself better???

SuziTone <tone102@...> wrote:

lol I seem to do it well though maybe with the exception of those oxygen masks

Suzi

What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered.

www.onegrp.com/?mamanott organic cosmetics

http://suziesgoats.wholefoodfarmacy.com/

Start your day with - make it your home page

[Guest guest]

To a degree yes... but let's start on you and not everyone else for awhile... I really feel you deserve this "ME TIME".... and deep down inside I think you do too. Toni, we all care about you and want you to get healthy...and to do this you have to think about you first... ok????

SuziTone <tone102@...> wrote:

isn't this what I am trying to do?

You may think you do it well, but you are hurting yourself... and think how much more you could do if you got yourself better???

Start your day with - make it your home page

[Guest guest]

Not so hard..... think back to when it started and what was happening around you, to you.. stress can do many strange things and especially when accompanied by other factors.

You can beat this Kathy. Go back to when it started and when you realize what triggered this you must release it... go within your mind and see yourself telling it "good bye" and walking away from it. (as in a sort of meditative state). Kathy L <angeldestiny@...> wrote:

It started about 3-4 years ago and I have been thinking that yes the stress has a lot to do with it....but it is hard to prove.

Suzi

What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered.

www.onegrp.com/?mamanott organic cosmetics

http://suziesgoats.wholefoodfarmacy.com/

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[Guest guest]

Kathy,

not literally but in a meditative state, see the problems and walk away from them in your mind... see them changing. Have you ever meditated?? You're taking back control first in your subconcious and then to the concious. Kind of like a dream... best way I know how to explain this. If your subconcious believes then the concious will, as seeing in your dream you walking out the door to go to the dentist (as an example)... See yourself taking control again. Do this every nite when you go to bed before you fall asleep.

SuziKathy L <angeldestiny@...> wrote:

I would have to walk away from my family. I can't do anything yet.

Kathy L.Angeldestiny's Dream NurseryRomanticsilk CraftsPlease cast your vote for my site on the Top 100www.romanticsilk.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Suzanne

health

Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 9:52 PM

Subject: Re: Re: my back... now, .making changes

Not so hard..... think back to when it started and what was happening around you, to you.. stress can do many strange things and especially when accompanied by other factors.

You can beat this Kathy. Go back to when it started and when you realize what triggered this you must release it... go within your mind and see yourself telling it "good bye" and walking away from it. (as in a sort of meditative state). Kathy L <angeldestiny@...> wrote:

It started about 3-4 years ago and I have been thinking that yes the stress has a lot to do with it....but it is hard to prove.

Suzi

What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered.

www.onegrp.com/?mamanott organic cosmetics

http://suziesgoats.wholefoodfarmacy.com/

Start your day with - make it your home page

Suzi

What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered.

www.onegrp.com/?mamanott organic cosmetics

http://suziesgoats.wholefoodfarmacy.com/__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I do sortof although it is very hard with this large family and small house.

On top of everything we just rushed my son to the hospital with stomach pains and they aren't sure if it is his appendix or not.

It has been a very challenging day and I am worn out but I guess it is not over yet......waiting to hear from my husband.

I did do something for myself though.......had some reflexology done and it was so relaxing. Turns out I went to school with her younger brother and sister and we spent a half hour chatting about the old neighbourhood.

Kathy L.Angeldestiny's Dream NurseryRomanticsilk CraftsPlease cast your vote for my site on the Top 100www.romanticsilk.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Suzanne

health

Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 10:50 PM

Subject: Re: Re: my back... now, .making changes

Kathy,

not literally but in a meditative state, see the problems and walk away from them in your mind... see them changing. Have you ever meditated?? You're taking back control first in your subconcious and then to the concious. Kind of like a dream... best way I know how to explain this. If your subconcious believes then the concious will, as seeing in your dream you walking out the door to go to the dentist (as an example)... See yourself taking control again. Do this every nite when you go to bed before you fall asleep.

SuziKathy L <angeldestiny@...> wrote:

I would have to walk away from my family. I can't do anything yet.

Kathy L.Angeldestiny's Dream NurseryRomanticsilk CraftsPlease cast your vote for my site on the Top 100www.romanticsilk.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Suzanne

health

Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 9:52 PM

Subject: Re: Re: my back... now, .making changes

Not so hard..... think back to when it started and what was happening around you, to you.. stress can do many strange things and especially when accompanied by other factors.

You can beat this Kathy. Go back to when it started and when you realize what triggered this you must release it... go within your mind and see yourself telling it "good bye" and walking away from it. (as in a sort of meditative state). Kathy L <angeldestiny@...> wrote:

It started about 3-4 years ago and I have been thinking that yes the stress has a lot to do with it....but it is hard to prove.

Suzi

What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered.

www.onegrp.com/?mamanott organic cosmetics

http://suziesgoats.wholefoodfarmacy.com/

Start your day with - make it your home page

Suzi

What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered.

www.onegrp.com/?mamanott organic cosmetics

http://suziesgoats.wholefoodfarmacy.com/

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

MorningGlory113@... wrote:

> So I shall think of Toni too but I cannot nor will not now or ever be

> selfish enough to put me first.

>

> Do you really think putting yourself first is selfish, Toni? Is it

> possible that putting yourself first is the most loving thing you can

> do for yourself and those that care about you? When you first do

> everything to take responsibility for your own life and truly care

> about yourself, you can then do more for others. That's like saying " I

> don't want to be a millionaire because there are others who are

> broke " . The truth is you can help others financially much better if

> you yourself are loaded!

> I believe that selfish people ONLY care about their own needs.

> Selfless people take care of their needs first and then have lots more

> energy and resources to lend a hand to others. Just my take on it.

> Gloria

==============================

Putting oneself first is not selfish. If one is not healthy and does not

take care of ones health first then one is being extremely negligent of

oneself and therefore one is being selfish by not being healthy enough

to properly help others. It is very hard to be positive when there are

so many problems going on with the body. Mind and body are inextricably

tied to one another. What affects one will affect the other. It is the

rare person who can rise above the body and operate in positive mode the

majority of the time.

So Toni, you are being selfish by not taking care of yourself. You are

selfishly denying others the experience of knowing you while you are in

health. You are, as we all are, an example for others to follow. Believe

it or not there are people out there who look to you for support and to

help them. We do this by making an example of ourselves and the best way

of doing that is through achieving excellent health. After all, you

cannot give to someone what you don't have for yourself. You have to

give to yourself first before you can ever truly give to another. This

goes with love too. If you don't love yourself first you will never

truly love another. If you don't take care of yourself you can never

truly take care of another.

This is my take on it.

--

Peace be with you, Toni.

Don " Quai " Eitner

" Spirit sleeps in the mineral, breathes in the vegetable, dreams in the animal

and wakes in man. "

Nearly all men die of their remedies, and not of their illnesses. ~Jean

Baptiste Molière, Le Malade Imaginaire

The obstacle is the path. ~Zen Proverb

[Guest guest]

Kathy,

Perhaps you can't physically walk away, but you can leave behind the

things that you let bother you about your family. There are many ways

to take yourself to a different place when in a enturbulated

situation. Start my claiming a room for yourself....go to it when you

need to. If you have a spare bathroom, you can claim it for

bubblebath ritual. If you still say " no " to all of this...that it is

not possible...then you can surround yourself in a white light. It is

a common exercise when entering an unsafe area.

Get yourself some Rescue Remedy.

Severing Negative Ties/Protection

" Quick fixes:

If you see or feel him near, you can re-enforce a barrier. Picture

your mind (or the previously connected area) in a chest (like a

treasure chest). The chest immediately slams shut and locks, sealing

with white or violet light…pulsating with the light, the light then

spreading to engulf you.

You can surround yourself in white light anytime for protection

against unwanted contact. "

http://www.magicwicca.com/rituals/ritual-ties.html

There are many rituals that you can perform...whether you believe in

them or not....they will work!!!! Only if it is to get you DOING

something, anything, about your situation.....they can distract you

from your fears, at the very least.

Rituals put intentions into physical form....transforming the

spiritual into the physical universe.

Kathy you obviously have the spirit to want to change but right now

it's just wanting to want to change. When you really have the want

you WILL change.

I hope you will look at the rituals thing....this will be making

changes. I hope you will stop saying " NO " to yourself.

Right now your rituals are all negative in direction.

I see that you are involved in crafts ...it could be very satifying

for you to make creative symbols....no voodoo dolls, please. :-) Kit

> It started about 3-4 years ago and I have been thinking that yes

the stress has a lot to do with it....but it is hard to prove.

>

>

>

> Suzi

>

> What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered.

>

> www.onegrp.com/?mamanott organic cosmetics

> http://suziesgoats.wholefoodfarmacy.com/

>

>

>

>

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>

>